Is Isaac del Toro a Serious Tour de France Contender Now? | Dauphiné Review | THEMOVE

Palay Pugachar and not very good news for the rivals of Pugachar and UAE in the Tour de France because the Toro is showing that he keeps making those steps to becoming one of the best stage races in the world and we all know that he's going to be his last guy, I mean everything

goes to plan. The last guy to be with Pugachar to eventually try to lounge her attacks on crucial

climb so if you know if today we would say if you look at the pro peloton, I would dare to say that the Toro is probably the third strongest writer in the Tour and he's going to be the guy who's next Pugachar. Everybody welcome back to the move. I'm Spencer Martin. I'm here with Johan Bernille. We are breaking down the Deauphinet, the Criterium Deauphinet that's not called that anymore,

the Toro race which the eight stage historic pre-tour de France tune up race in the

“the key to the Deauphinet is the reason people like it as it does a lot of climbs and routes that”

you might do in the tour. It's kind of a mountain stage, only mountain, yes stage, only version of a one week stage race in South Central France. I guess today they've finished on plateau do so, how do you say that's climbing on? Is it the position? Salaison, which is the finished stage 15 of the Tour de France on and Ezek del Toro, your pick won the overall because he won the final stage by

minute over one of you so with Tobias Holland, Johansson right at the day in my opinion, and third one

of two back and since we've talked, there's been two mountain stages, the other mountain stage on stage seven, del Toro won as well, 24 seconds over one of you so with Tobias Holland, Johansson to third, 30 seconds back. So this is a trend we're seeing where the same three guys get one, two, and three on mountain stages. We saw that that at the year to tell you a lot, it meant the overall was Ezek del Toro. And first, Luke, who crazily did not wear the leaders jersey at any point in this race and tell

the final podium in the summer stake. And Luke took while who was the race leader going into the final stage, read on Red Bull Borough, Hans Grove, he's 21 year old Australian super impressive right. He's second 54 seconds back. So he really held on one of you so in third at 117 back, Mateo, Jordan's in 136 back. He fell from the second place on the final day after being dropped. It was in small margins here outside of the winning margin. And then Tobias Holland, Johansson in 146

and fifth, and that's impressive because he lost over three minutes on stage one. And then

“clawed his way back into the top five. But Johan, what was your big takeaway from this race?”

Well, I mean, as you said, Spencer, the Dolphin A are during the Oven, your own, as they call it,

the nowadays great preparation race for the Tour de France. I've always been a fan of this race

for several reasons and it looks like this season. Again, I think it's a great general repetition for the Tour de France. Sometimes they do feature on purpose stages or climbs that also feature in the Tour de France. For example, last yesterday's final climb is going to be one of the hard stages in the Tour de France on stage 15 or 16 if I'm not mistaken. So already that, you know, you get used to the racing and France on French roads. Obviously, there's not the same amount of

public. But it gives you a bit of a feel, right? You kind of get a taste of what you're going to be presented in the month of July during the Tour de France. So I like that. But yeah, the

“Tour hallist and the Tour was outstanding, I think. Looked, always in control, wrote very smart,”

didn't make any mistakes, I think. And on top of that, his team, UAE, which was strong, was able to take advantage, full advantage of several race situations that let other teams do the work. I think the takeaway of this is, and of course, we haven't spoken about all sex outs and his crash, we will get into that crash on Saturday stage with, you know, consequences that he couldn't defend his position. But I personally think independently of that incident with,

with such a tough, tough Toro was the best rider of this race. And it's obviously great news for UAE and for the La Pogacchar and not very good news for the rivals of Pogacchar in the Tour de France, because the Toural is showing that he keeps making those steps to becoming one of the best

goes to plan. The last guy to be with Pogacchar to eventually try to launch attacks on crucial

climbs. So if, you know, today we would say, if you look at the pro Peloton, I would dare to say that the Toural is probably the third strongest rider in the Tour. And he's going to be the guy who's next to Pogacchar. So that's not very motivating and hopeful for the rivals of Pogacchar for the Tour de France. But yeah, I mean, the Toural is still young, is, you know, making his name has one of them an amazing amount of races. If I'm not mistaken, did he not win? 22 races last year.

“Oh, that's a good question. He went a lot. I remember it being 19, but let me, okay, I mean,”

when I'm 19 is more than most people win and they're career. And it's a, yeah, wait, yeah, no, it was 19 last year. And this year, he's one, one, two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight races. And even more impressive than that is he was extremely hurt. You know, last time we saw him, he could barely get his leg over his bike because he crashed out of, was it, what the, it's Julia? Was it, oh, no, it's Julia. Because he won you a tour. He won

tour. I know. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. And then it crashes out of it, Julia, I was kind of worried about them. And then no, no reason to be worried. We're seeing that. Again, Spencer, it's this, it's this new trend cycling. Especially with these young riders, they get injured. They're out of competition.

“They come back straight away, top level. We see it all the time. You know, we said the same with”

advice in, uh, in the giro, uh, funkils, Alten's February, uh, with with a fracture of the pelvis, the autora was injured. I don't think his injuries were as bad as narvice and funkils, but still, looked ready, uh, did a lot of preparation together with Poachar, altitude training and recon. So,

must be an amazing feeling for the autoro and for, uh, especially for Poachar and UAE to have

this kind of support, uh, coming into the big objective of the season, which is a tour of France. Yes. Yeah. And as you said, you can't be feeling good. If you're not, if you're not del Toro, I mean, just to give people, I'm not going to break this down stage by stage. But yesterday was a tour of France S stage. We had four categorized climbs, starts off on a cat one climb. 7k long at 9.4%. That's the start of the race, Johan. Ouch. Then they go into an HC climb. They go up that to

send down, start an HC climb 11k, 11.5k 9%. That's the second climb of the day. Third climb of the day, 7k at 7%. And these are all one after the other. This is crammed into 120k. They descend down this kind of the first valley. Like, you know, it's kind of around like salanche. They could get these big valleys with the mountains around you. They descend down and they do the final climb. It's 11.5k at 9%. Another HC climb. And as you said, his UAE team didn't have to do anything

all day. They sit back, little tracks do in the work. And then UAE comes forward, they have four four riders in front of them, boom, boom, boom, boom, they go through them. And then by the time he's ready to go, the pace is so high. It doesn't really attack. It just kind of rides off the sides. It was, I mean, I looked at this with particular attention because it was Pablo Torres the young rider from Madrid who, by the way, also starts his season here after a knee operation

“knee surgery. I mean, I think he had a few races then he had knee problems, had a surgery,”

and has just come into action again. And I mean, that lost pool of Pablo Torres was like, that they'll totally just had, you didn't have to attack or anything, just because they were long already with the two of them. I mean, but yeah, I mean, I think UAE was true circumstances,

didn't have to do that much, didn't have to control the race, never had to bring a breakaway back.

And I think it's, I mean, you know, with Tuckwell, with Tuckwell in the lead, you would have thought, well, maybe UAE will have to do the work because I think Red Bull was down to three riders if I'm not mistaken. But then Liv Trek came in, because they still have, they still had the eight, lots of abundance, by the way, in this race. I think there was 150 riders at the start.

rider Peloton on the last stage, which you clearly see. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

“And I mean, little, well, here, let's take a quick break. We'll talk about a little”

track's decision to work. And, and how EZiktal Toro is like, Jill and Bronson. That's the leap I'm going to make when we come back from this ad break. Everybody this episode is brought to by drip drop between nonstop travel for work and trying to stay active. I can feel when water just isn't cutting it. That's when I reach for drip drop to help me rebound faster and stay sharp, no matter how full my plate is for me. Spin a total game changer. After a long recording session

or I just, I flew transatlantic a couple times in the course of a week. And I was feeling a little depleted. But drip drop, boom, pop that in my drink. I feel good as new. drip drop is Dr. Developed proven fast hydration that helps your body and mind work better. Think support for busy work days, long workouts and everything between it uses science-based formulas for rapid hydration. So you feel results fast while getting three times the electrolytes of leading sports drinks.

It's even trusted by firefighters, medical professionals, and over 90% of top college and pro sports teams. They've also just developed zero sugar plus a breakthrough formula with an

advanced blend of six key electrolytes, 15 essential vitamins and nutrients and no sugar or artificial

“sweeteners. And honestly, all of the products taste amazing. They have 16 original flavors and”

eight zero sugar plus options of a few chant fan of the juicy lemon myself. And they have a flexible subscription option. So you're never stuck without it. Right now, drip drop is offering podcast listeners 20% off your first order. Go to drip drop.com and use promo code the move. That's drip drop dot com promo code the move for 20% off stock up now at drip drop dot com. It's getting hot out there and use promo code the move. Everybody this episode is brought to

bite up work scaling a business is really about having the right expertise at the right time and realizing you don't actually have to do everything yourself. That's something I've learned in the hard way and where up work can really help. Up work is a one stop flat platform to find higher and pay expert freelancers across web and software development data and analytics marketing business operations and more. It gives you fast access to special like talent across 125 plus

category so you can fill skill gaps, launch projects faster and scale support up or down without committing to a full time higher. And what I like is how easy it is to find the right person. You could browse profiles review past work and even get help scoping the role so you can hire with confidence and get started quickly. And if you need top tier talent fast with business plus you can access the top 1% of freelancers on up work with AI powered short listing you get matched to the

right person in under six hours. No endless searching up work also handles this is huge handles the contracts and payments all in one place which cuts down on a ton. I cannot stress how much that cuts down on in terms of operational hassle. It's free to sign up posting a job as easy and thousands of growing businesses are already using it to scale smarter. Visit upwork.com right now to post your job for free even if you don't have a job to post just check out the site you'll be

blown away. That's upwork.com to connect with top talent ready to help your business grow. That's U.P. W. O. R. K. dot com. Upwork dot com. So Johan yeah little track was at the front a lot U. A. I mean U. A. This this raise couldn't have worked out better for them. They didn't have to do anything yesterday because little track came forward but it was a weird in their defense it was a weird situation is one of the weirdest agencies I've seen in a while there was no shape or form

to it you had Alex Bodon also that what this is a kind of a case study for why it's so good to give the jersey away because Alex Bodon gets the jersey on stage one. EF does a ton of work for the

first chunk of stages and then look talk well goes into a break away. Too much don't do that. That's

too much time he's too good of a writer he can cost someone they probably cost Matteo Jorgans in the podium because that happened but then now he's responsible for the jersey but going into the stage it was Tuckwell in first Matteo Jorgans in in second 42 seconds del Toro in third 49 seconds back I use so fourth one of six back so little track has to drop Tuckwell I mean everybody has to drop Tuckwell but then they also have to drop del Toro in Jorgansin or one of them or one of those three

if they want to get on the podium so at some point they do kind of have to make the race hard and I guess it was just circumstance worked in UA's favor and they didn't have to do anything I mean do you think a little track should have called UA's bluff and said hey you guys want to win this race you want to replace hard I don't think so you know I mean they all pursued different

“objectives I think after after Saturday stage I think it was already clear to everybody that del Toro”

was going to be the big favorite even if there was not that same distance between him and

track had at the start and you know that you're going to have two riders which are a

“you so and scale most on the last climb you know what are the other six going to do right”

I mean you may as well get a last really good drill-in I'm pretty sure that all these riders of little track did that job with pleasure even if they knew that it was going to be difficult but at the end of the day they do get on the podium you know a guy like Tuckwell for example

you never know what's going to happen you know it's a good rider he's young he got that advantage

it's enough that you know if Tuckwell has a great day and your leader doesn't have a great day maybe you don't take the leaders jersey in the case of in the case of UAE because then to immediately what was it 50 seconds the difference in between second and first and second 40 something seconds for the two seconds yeah so I don't know and final result it was right it was 54 seconds yeah okay anyways that Toro had a great climb so but you don't know that

on before and right what we did know for sure was that Red Bull was never going to be in a position to defend the jersey so somebody had to do it and so a little freckled have said okay UAE it's your turn would it have changed the end result I don't think so I don't think I don't think it would have changed anything it definitely absolutely would not have changed anything which we should put that

like what would happen it was always gonna happen there's there was have no strings to pull

the only question we have to ask ourselves Spencer is you know what was with the outcome have been

“of this race without the crash of Paul's exhaust I think that's the big discussion point right”

Saturday Saturday stage was was a hard stage success crashed early on we didn't get to see it in the in the footage but apparently it was it was another great crash I mean it was on a downhill he himself you know set and admitted that was his own fault apologize he said he got he's gotten used to which is also something that I think he should try to get rid of that you know habit

of he he discovered that he was always in a position to overtake riders in the downhill don't do

that don't just don't do that you know not not not not in turns so that was a good lesson for him but obviously it was it was a serious crash he came back with the help of his team and then finally

“success did a good climb a lot the last climb but lost one minute 20 I think on the Toro”

but 40 seconds on on Jurgenson so it was clear then that success was not going to win this race the question was just okay is it possible he recovers and doesn't all or nothing attempt in stage in the last stage turned out that was not possible he started the stage and abandoned straightaway but there's been a lot of talk Spencer about this unbelievable pursuit of and and comeback but he yes he was like a little over four minutes down four minutes down

and the pace was on like he was on in the front yeah yeah so it was quite heroic you know I mean that deket long has been praised for their decisions and I think you know they did make really good decision they had first they had two riders weight like the two big time trolleys down down hole and pissiger they rode in the valley like crazy and then two climbers who I mean paripantre the brother of who is it Valentin knows the other guy yes or really yeah paripantre

yes amazing pursuit you know and and to come back four minutes on a peloton which was definitely not waiting for sure not I mean the race was on I it was again little track right who was drilling at that point I mean it was basically quince Simmons was on the front from almost the entire final two days which yes press yeah that guy strong that guy strong that guy strong from the breakaway on stage seven and then they caught him and he just slotted in yeah he said he should then chase that breakaway down

he's super strong so I mean I'm pretty sure our podcast colleague George Hengupi won't be crying watching these stages obviously seeing the stars and striping after the America doing

George in that same jersey doing a lot of work for Lance at the tour of course of course I mean

“that's what yeah it's like yeah he has forgot he has forgotten about that yeah yeah yeah”

yeah okay I don't think we can compare right I mean little track doesn't have type of rider like Lance was who was you know you had almost a guaranteed trip it's not the same win they did when a leader jersey at the tour last year though that's pretty important yes yes yes yeah it depends you know what the goal is right but yeah I mean then I mean there's been a lot of praise and applause and for this for this unbelievable for suit and comeback what do you think Spencer

well this is this is you know I race at a level where there were cars there was no TV you could get away with a lot and my first thought was I think I think I think some there was maybe some cars involved in this chase would it would I be incorrect about that there was absolutely cars involved I mean for four minutes you may have the strongest rider and the strongest teammates four minutes on Kanna Peloton which is not waiting is impossible I don't want to diminish

the performance of of of six outs okay it was amazing what he did how he fought back and then

especially how he made how he maintained his level of performance on the last climb after that crash that was we were really really incredible but I am not 100 1000% sure that there was a lot of maneuvers involved to you know we didn't see the whole pursuit and I did speak to people who were in the caravan so there's an anonymous opinion that the cars were very very very helpful and that you know a blind eye of the commissars which you know at at some point you can say okay

it's not fair a guy who has crashed okay it's one of the favorites crashes form part of racing

“of course but as long as it's not too obvious I think that riders who have crashed can't take”

advantage of the caravan as long as it's not on purpose you know being like five kilometer behind

one car right yes yeah but I do think I do think that the commissars were very lenient towards the French favorite compared to sometimes other things that I see in races where they straight away make a barrage and they say okay you know what this this is it you can't right behind this car or you know get find or they qualify sometimes yeah this was not the case here anyways independently of that I think it was it was a great performance of of sex us and I hope that he can recover from

this crash I guess well I got a lot of concern when you hear I can't grip the bars safely what it kind of sounds like maybe I mean he will be at the start of the tour de France I have no doubt about that but it's obviously this terms your preparation now I don't know probably he's going to go back to altitude that was probably the plan he will do that but he will have to recover a bit from it he's young so you know these guys are made of rubber compared to the older guys who kind of

break bones and so he will bounce back but it's not ideal which you know what in the end it might not be such a bad thing because it takes pressure off him it does you know he will he will be at the start of the tour he may I mean his ambition obviously is sky high right he wants to the best possible he this guy I think in his mind as very very realistic ambitions to be on the podium of the tour de France that's his goal but now with this crash he kind of does have an excuse if it doesn't

work out which I think you know the team and his entourage should probably use this as a weapon

“to protect him from too much pressure that's what I how I would see it what can you imagine if you”

would have won this the amount of pressure it would have been too much it's a gift it's a gift yeah I think I think so too it's also the word of one I mean I don't know let's say it goes in healthy I don't know if he beats del Toro what do you think I don't think he would have beaten a little total no I mean I don't know if I said this on the show yet but I estimated his power

that's up there with vineyards best performances at the year oh but I think on top of that Spencer okay we have the numbers that's an estimate okay that you know sex off's probably close to that but I think we have to add into this equation the unbelievable intelligence of del Toro he's so raised smart he is and knows how to win races you know it's not it's not a coincidence that this guy wins so many races he's strong super strong but there's a lot of strong guys who don't win races and del Toro

somehow figures out how to win which is a great great talent to have well yes example of that stage seven it's steep this grand Colombia it's not the

“center I remember I think it's it's the first it's the first time they go up this okay different”

different ways and this was the shortest way to the top so obviously also the steepest way

very steep yeah they've never done this before in a race okay yeah yeah yeah so there was a section like

4k at 14% one of you sort of tax at the bottom which you which can't happen because you're like I'm strong it's steep I'm gonna go but we talked about this extensively a few years ago with the premos it was the premos guarantee time trial and it was super steep and there times are about the same and then when it got flatter premos pulled his gap out of one the zero so you kind of when it's like that it's counterintuitive you don't want to go you don't want to go too fast on the

altras steep section because your gains are limited del Toro sits back let's I used to go and then at the very end of the steep section he attacks it gets a little less steep and he just kind of moes him down methodically catches him right when he wants to catch him and then goes right

by him wins the stage it was it was a clinic basically on how to chase someone down and

“pass them in distance them on a climb it was really impressive yeah yeah I thought I mean I think”

I used to go out a bit over excited obviously listen it's understandable also you know he he probably feels really strong again it's the first time since this season and since his crash in and Pyrenees where by the way he was in the liters jersey crashed out that he feels again you know great feelings in a position it's understandable you kind of get excited and want to go yes his interview after the race was very honest straight away you know he admitted his mistake

and he got he said he got too excited and it was you know he was an idiot and then he said

some other words which we won't mention here it was very self critical either as I was

shockingly self aware yeah I was pretty surprised yeah so you know good for him I mean it's it's a

“great sign to see I also in that kind of shape it's great for a little track also I mean they”

they I mean it's that's good enough for a podium in the tutor front that's a different different story but anyways you know he's he's back to where he belongs and yeah but I mean they'll total man he's I just I just think they'll total is on another level first of all I would say talent wise he's a pure talent you can see literally you know you can see these guys with natural talent and class it's so smooth it looks effort I mean it's not

effort that it looks so effortless it's so fluid it's a beauty to watch compared to some other riders where you see the effort you know as you see it's mathematical it's the total looks like a natural god all a bicycle he does actually yeah he looks like I was just riding on my street to do the show and he looked how I felt riding on the flat you know he looks just it's so smooth it doesn't look like labor at all there's gonna come a point Spencer you know with age where

even on the flat you're not gonna feel like that you were probably going roughly the same speech a 9% grade of me on a 0% grade but you you mentioned this there's winners I mean this sounds this is gonna sound stupidly simple there's winners and there's losers the reason I mentioned Jalen Bronson like the next just won the title so Jalen Bronson's 6-1 maybe maybe 6 feet tall second round draft pick but he's just won at every level one in high school one in college

won in the NBA and he beat victor women yama who's a foot and half taller than him it doesn't make any logical sense he's just a winner but you don't really like to hear that because it sounds too simple but it like I don't know if you've noticed this the same guys win every race and cycling right now it's the same collection of four people it's it's kind of shocking how

say wow there's a lot of good writers and then we could have said probably dealt I mean this was an

“unusual race because there's three three guys who have recently won big one week stage races”

del Toro Sashas success and I use so both have won major one week stage races recently but there's usually one or two guys that you can say like hey that's gonna be the winner and you're going to be right it's really blows my mind yeah guys it's it's very straightforward you want to hear teams that have won one week stage races this is pretty crazy when this season the last two seasons so this is the big seven so you know this was UAE so UAE

UAE to Cathlan, Visma UAE UAE UAE UAE, UAE, UAE, Red Bull, UAE that's nuts and then

yeah grand tours are basically all UAE or Visma so not only is it the same writers it's the

same teams yeah yeah maybe go to those teams if you're out of contract in your street racer would seem to be that's where you're going to win uh wait I might have missed uh sorry I missed a little trick is one of you so one last year oh I didn't go over firm enough so yeah he why why he red bull if he went a little trick Visma are you so one he's actually wask he won Torino they went the day and oh yeah last year and this year he won no this year he

won this one basket and Torino yeah the same one yeah this year he won all Garva didn't yes anything else I think Paul six six six yeah yeah yeah and then six us 19 years old these are already one one of these one-winged stages it's pretty crazy um but yeah if you're not on Visma I mean little trick kind of it's it kind of better success what I use as only one two of them but when you look at the list of writers there's not many writers actually that

of one major one-week stages and then primos is one 11 of them which is kind of the for example

“a guy like Remko hasn't won a single one no no yeah so that's how difficult it is to win those races”

and Pagachar is only one six so yeah like well yeah it didn't really focus on it I was thinking Spencer you know like it's it's crazy like I was just reviewing so Pagachar is not going to start

to have Switzerland right and you know people were kind of I'm gonna say critical but like

casting certain doubts about you know his performance in two of Rem and he you know he wasn't far he was people long time ago he wasn't far and off ahead of of lipowits and then you look he he was the six stages the guy won four stages and he overall without I mean if that's Pagachar not being in great shape for stage races imagine what is going to be if he's like like 10% better which is probably going to be the case the people people love to do this it's yeah yeah it's an

international pastime the third place rider was 244 down it's not like he's squeaking out winds by time bonuses either but let's take another ad break and then we'll talk about the riders that are not um E-siktol Toro in Paul success at this race and how they did everybody this episode is about to buy sheath underwear here's a hot take most underwear is terrible and if you've ever had a ride longer than expected and non-cycling clothes maybe a hot day through London you know

that is comfort down there and it's not a minor inconvenience it's a full-on issue that affects everything but sheath has figured this out their dual pouch design keeps everything separated reduces skin contact and eliminates you adjusting the sticking the chafing once you try it you genuinely wonder why no one did this sooner the fabrics are premium too bamboo classic cotton lightweight and breathable in a way that actually holds up whether you're grinding through

a workout or just getting through a travel day to get to a race it's got a great backstory too sheath was invented by an active duty soldier designed for long harsh sweaty days in the field recommended by your all just trusted by elite athletes across UFC weightlifting and golf this isn't a fashion underwear brand it's a performance product that just happens to be the most comfortable thing you'll put on all day so feel it to believe it got a sheath dot com slash the move

and use code the move for 20% off your order sheath even offers of first pair guarantee so if it's not

“for you it's is no risk here you get your money back and honestly once you try these there's no going back”

that's s-h-e-a-t-h dot com slash the move and use code the move for 20% off sheath dot com slash the move sheath the underwear of legends thanks to sheath for supporting this episode everybody this episode is brought to by NordVPN which has become a must have for me to keep up with

and I'm I'm on the move so I need NordVPN and I'm using it right now because I'm in the UK and it's almost impossible to watch cycling in the UK like I literally would not be able to watch the dolphin a which out with without NordVPN so thank you so much much NordVPN for letting me do that also it's key for watching these finals I got to watch the next spurs even though it's a two in the

“morning and you must be asking but it's got to be hard right with NordVPN no it's not it's easy”

incredibly easy just literally you open the app one click to connect and you got 7500 servers in 118 countries you can change your virtual location effortlessly NordVPN is also one of the

fastest VPNs out there so I never deal with buffering when I'm streaming a big mountain stage plus

one NordVPN account that's going to work across 10 devices that's got to be more than enough for almost everybody listening and it supports every major platform Windows Android iOS Mac OS you name it they got it so to get the best discount off your NordVPN plan go to NordVPN dot com slash to move our link will give you four extra months on the two-year plan there's no risk but Nord's 30 day money back guarantee link is in the episode show notes okay Johan so

want to use so get second he was 24 seconds back on stage seven I thought that despite the pacing issues super impressive and then a min and back on stage eight finishes third I'm still like this race is boggling my mind that del Toro and I use so we're not one and two he finishes third one 17 back we still have to talk about Luke talk well we'll talk about him in a second but want to use so coming out of this race how are you feeling if you're him his team is management

“I feel great I feel great I think his performance I mean there's always a difference between”

the performance and the result when he did get two pretty good results out of those last two stages third NGC mid third or second doesn't really matter that much for are you so I think and I think

he knows that he could never have been del Toro and then you know if you calculate in the

factor that what if say sauce wouldn't have crashed then maybe he wasn't going to be on the podium so I think it's it's a great result for him for little freck they wrote very well as a team and the two stages where I also needed to be present and perform he did I feel great and it's definitely very hopeful for him to you know to be on track for a good two of the fronts how old is that you so now 23 it's an old man he's 23 oldest oldest rider on the podium that's race

that's another big old rider that crazy I don't know the podium yeah but I mean you know what's crazy Spencer is that these guys like like I use so you know he basically has no hope for the white jersey he said yeah spot casket just because isn't this crazy every week we're just like can you believe this yeah what's going on here but it's it's we're living through more more than cycling crazy times but in cycling it's it is really mind blowing

times I mean I used to was over a minute off the white jersey at this race yeah and the right is really no chance of the tour it's I mean so it's sex us and the door the door oh yeah

well be on the podium of the white jersey within amazing race well we will see we'll see we'll see

I mean with yeah I don't think he's elevated anymore no no he's 26 now I'm going I think yeah too sorry that's the cutoff I guess you have to be 25 or under yeah yeah which which they

“have to change to have to change that yeah you have I think you have to be under 23 at least under 23”

if not under 21 yeah it should it probably to make it a truly interesting like oh that is a writer of the future it probably should be yeah 21 and under if you really wanted it to accomplish the goal that it's supposed to yeah I'd say for the moment that would lower it to 23 years old for the moment we'll see how this you know Trent it's probably going to keep going that way there's no reason why it shouldn't but 23 25 is too is too old for the white jersey

yes and I think last week I mean just in general the last few years have been thinking man look like a high schooler just beat the Olympic the Olympic champion in the 100 meters like a high schooler from America just beat them in a diamond lake race it is it's crazy out there folks these young kids are reaching levels we didn't think we're possible and I've been a big believer of

is a great example of why experienced does matter like maybe don't pass people on early on descents early in a stage when you don't absolutely need to like that does show you experience especially over three weeks because there's more surface area to make mistakes does matter

yeah yeah and sometimes you know like immediate gain doesn't really always translate

“yeah and a final gain over three weeks you need to be conservative but he will learn he's a”

fast learner is guy I think I use so I'm pretty hard on him probably but I think this is a great it's a great race form and he probably won't get the recognition he should because he only gets third and he can't win the tour can't win the light jersey but this is like big improvement I think the way he raised how close he was yeah the win and especially these were hard climbs like especially hard times and he did it hard hard climbs that's for sure which has been a bit of

I'm gonna say a weak point but that's where we have seen him fail now and then and in this stage race on the two hardest climbs of the race he was each time the second strongest rider which yes very good very good very promising behind a freak too like if Del Toro is not at this race where we're sitting here saying well actually are are we sitting here saying that because what he have lost to look talk well that's kind of an interesting thing maybe he would have

raised differently and look talk well would have been attacked at different points but what do we make of this second place 21 years old Australian you hadn't heard about him and I and Australian did bring up to me that there does seem to be a bit of bias when it comes to certain riders get hyped

when they're 2019 or 20 and then certain riders are getting incredible results and we don't

seem to mention them like look talk well like he gets six that Romandi in another life we're saying wow can you believe this 21 year old getting six that Romandi but we don't really notice that anymore

“but clearly he's a very good rider yeah and it is is this I think it's this this guy that was leading”

the the year next gen last year until the last stage till the last stage so obviously you're good climber then I heard I mean I haven't gone into detail but there's been some like a very dramatic family situation also I think his younger sister passed away or something I think she was also a cyclist and then the whole family came over to Europe I mean I haven't but anyways this guy is a big talent good climber obviously good climber

I don't think he expected to be in this situation before the race but you know once he was in that no break away and got that time he fought for it and yesterday with the help of an amazing maximum of hills who was facing him up till the finish basically I think one hills that the

climb of his life yesterday because he would never be in he could go uphill but he's not a real

pure climber and man he rode like a madman to get talk well to the finish

“which is an impressive impressive result so yeah I think those those guys will go away very very”

happy you know second place overall a stage when in vengils finishing the ride that the definitely I think with three riders only pretty good pretty good pretty pretty good yeah a lot of teams didn't get that out of the race so the Red Bull can't complain about I mean I guess Van Hills was paying them back for stage six is where he got the first one for choosing his polling for Van Hills then well yeah he was also pulling for the leaders jersey

yeah if I didn't even know that was a good well I was just helping you Maxine helped me on stage eight but yeah I don't really know what to make of this I mean you do kind of see it from time to time riders like this and then you don't see it again but the way he got it on a tough climbing stage she got the jersey and then he defended pretty well like he was drunk but nine and a half kid ago yesterday doesn't lose that much time by the finish he was only

143 down with a big group of you know he was with Mateo Jorgensen in that group so clearly he's a very good climber in a stage and then and then he rode away from Jorgensen no or no or was it I think he like I think he rode away with him but they had the same time okay it wasn't really time gap yeah and then another guy is Spencer Tobias Johansson yeah this is crazy that's that

over three minutes on stage one which is obviously you know and then you know already you can't win or you can't be on the podium of that race and then he just clawed back and the last three days he was up there all the time and finished was he third last yesterday he was third in stage no he was third he was closing and fast yeah he was only two seconds behind him at the finish and he almost won a stage on he he was the one sprinting against Maxime Van Hills on stage six yeah

and this guy finished fifth in the due to France last year wait can that be true yeah I thought go check he finished sixth because Phil is fifth I'll fix yeah okay yeah so yeah but what's we even we're here is this is the second time this has happened this year at Ezzulia Bass Country he's dropped loses over four minutes on stage two and then he's in the break away three the last four days finishes out of podium finished is third over all proving it's this weird

logic circle where you lose time early it frees you up to get in the break away so you're free to gain the time you've lost back that you wouldn't be free to do had you not lost time and then

“you end up where you began what's as extreme so I think there's a biological factor to this also you”

do have these riders who come in a stage race and they're you know they struggle and they won or two and then they kind of lose and up and get better so I think in this case probably I'm just gonna guess but you know all of you know X were at an altitude camp they came straight from altitude down to the Dolphin A and Johannes and must have struggled with the change with the sudden change and felt terrible on stage one but it seems that this is a trend with him you know

finishes stages always really strong and usually tends to start them and not so good condition

I mean you can also argue that if he wouldn't be as bad in the beginning he probably wouldn't be as good at the end you know it gets better yeah to flip the results or to flip the roles you would say there's a lot of riders that can't get into breakaways at will in stage races you know to get just be able to get in breakaways seemingly whenever he wants is really impressive not many riders that can do that I know UNOX doesn't have a really aggressive altitude protocol and actually

a friend of the show who is a very famous trainer for a very famous team for a very famous rider disagrees with it and thinks it's too aggressive and potentially this is proving him to be correct that they are flying a little too close to the sun with some of the altitude preparation because this is a trend at this point that he's having a hard time early in stage races yeah but I think it's also the proof Spencer that the same system doesn't work for everybody it's yeah you know I think

“you need to be able to tailor it to the needs and the way people different people react differently”

to certain situations I think you're on a side by now is probably enough of an experienced professional to know that I mean this is gonna teach him to do things differently I mean listen we're just guessing right though we don't know exactly what happened but it's it's fascinating to see him finish these stages on such a high level when you know after stage one or two you say okay well I guys done yeah I know I said I said every time and he's proved me wrong two times at a row

he's a handy rider to have on your team I mean he can win he can win out of breakaways he can finish

high up in the GC and he never gives up that's he's kind of the perfect you know it's

top ten of the tutor friends so many riders that can do that he's a really if top ten of the tutor friends and then he's explosive enough to get in breaks when everyone's trying to give in the break he's the perfect rider for that team like that's exactly what they need at this point and level that they're right now before we go to ad break I want to ask you about Matteo Jordan sense so he has a disappointing final day falls off the podium I got I get so many

messages about Matteo where they're like oh like what does this mean from Matteo and say you know I I wasn't blown away that he was dropped I kind of think he's getting played out of position here

“a little bit I like him as a classics rider I think he's a great cobbled rider I think he's a great”

art hands rider he's a he can be a great one-week stage racer but we've never really seen them ride super hard

alpine mountains that he just the masses against him he's very very big guy finishes in a strong

this like if you're a Matteo if you're the team how do you feel about where you finish I think he did

“I think he did well also Spencer let's not forget this is another rider who comes back from injury”

he broke his collarbone and yeah in the classics no like this is the first time he's back right

to me he didn't do any other races before hey brass is followed on an am so golden and this is the first time he's raised exactly so you know let's take that into account and you win the stage and the team time trial I don't know if you can just try that okay yeah okay yeah okay yeah he was the first guy to finish that yeah I think I think we couldn't have expected anything better if you look at you know the autoro and and I use so I mean talk well obviously is the surprise but

I don't think Matteo would have been any any situation to beat the autoro for the question I've been second class he's been second and he's been second and he's been second and he I think I mean he's very good at

“he has been second and 2020 I'm pretty much yeah he's very good at I think outperforming what”

like he or let's just say maximizing his best possible result in a stage he's he's very good at doing yeah and I think it kind of gives people unfair expectations about where he should be I mean yeah I guess if he gets second you can win so yeah it's only eight seconds behind primos yeah but and also let's not forget double to double parrini's winner but this is different you know these these are these are hard mountains and I think Matteo

I mean he's he's a very solid rider but there's always going to be people who out climb him

especially on these steep climbs I mean the last few stages had this last steep climb he's at the disadvantage there so I think I mean he obviously was racing to be on the podium he's not but the performance of Matteo Jürgenson was I think on par with what we could expect from him and these are just different this is a different class of I want to I feel like a manager but there's a different class of riders like 2024 dofinay pretty much winch wins Matteo second Derek G's third Carlos Rodriguez is fourth

Lawrence de Plusus fifth you know Matteo is still beating all those guys it's not like he's got worse there's just freaks ahead of them the number one question we get is Ken Matteo Jürgenson

Winnegrant tour I think the answer is is no right I think that should be an expectation no I think

he can at best win in in great situation with a field which is you know doesn't have these toprots at best maybe a podium if he outperforms himself but winning no I don't think so I don't think this is always going to be somebody who just a lot better in the mountains yeah I mean I this is it's not going to happen because of who's ahead of him but you know he's also mean time is ticking you're very fast yes what is he 26 27 now he's funny that that's getting up there he is getting

up there in age he's a I mean he's also an amazing he's 26 amazing climbing domestic because he's so big and and so good climbing and very and very steady like he that he's the ideal guy to set that rhythm or be like be just before the big guys go right that's I think that's his climbing rhythm and and and that's yeah I mean you can win really good races like Pyrenees like Catalonia even tour the bus country when it's really like harder climbs like these last two ones

it becomes a problem I mean he has one a cobbled clap but I think people forget this he's want a cobbled classic towards to our vlanerin the expectation if you win that race should not be

“you now you have to win a grand tour it's unique to have those skills yeah to be able to combine”

those kind of races with doing great gc's and even winning some of those one of each stage races I mean it's not not for me to do but if I was defining this goals for the next season I'd say winning still gold top five tour flanners target a non-alpine one week stage race be be one of the world's best domestic and a grand tour because that's what you are I mean to have a guy like that they can work in valleys and on climbs is is really unique let's take a quick break and we're

going to ask you about easick del tour we're gonna we'll talk about sues for four seconds because I think we know it's gonna happen but I'm gonna ask you about easick del tour with the tour

here's something most people don't think about modern racers have actually trained us to press harder than we need to and it's not your fault it's a design problem most cartridge racers have springs and flexible blade mounts the blade moves slightly mid stroke the cutting angle shifts and you get that tugging feeling I know that well so naturally you just press harder to compensate but the more pressure means more friction and that's where the irritation comes from hints and

racers work differently they were designed by aerospace machinist in Canada instead of letting the blade flex and move around they lock into a fixed precise cutting angle no springs no pivot just clean consistent geometry that is exactly what it's supposed to every single stroke I've been easy one and outside of feeling like I'm in an episode of Madman with the blades classy old school design honestly the biggest adjustment is just learning how little pressure you actually need it's

“one of those things you have to experience to believe and if you're a cyclist trying to keep those”

legs shaved hints and design is perfect in fact I think it works better for the legs than it does my

face I've always had issues with my course hair like clogging up traditional safety razors it's a

disaster but with hints and I'm able to make quick work of those legs in the shape quality is seriously impressive I can't recommend it enough I'm never going back you can't make me go back to my standard razors if you want to try it for yourself hints and is offering a hundred free blades with the purchase of a razor just head to hints and shaving dot com slash the move and use code the move that check out that's hints and shaving dot com slash the move for a hundred free blades

everybody this episode is brought to you by no CD as a cyclist you know what it's like to listen to your body but sometimes a signal just won't quit is that tiny sensation of my body actually is serious illness what if something is wrong and I keep pushing through it anyway and no matter how many miles you put in or how many doctors say you're fine the thought just keeps coming back for millions of people that kind of loop isn't just nerves or training anxiety you can actually

be OCD not the organizing stereotype real OCD is persistent unwanted intrusive thoughts that feel totally out of character along with mental or physical behaviors that you feel driven to do to get relief these thoughts can feel very real which makes them so upsetting but it doesn't have to be that way because OCD is highly treatable with the right kind of specialized therapy OCD needs ERP or exposure in response prevention which is proven to be the most effective treatment

and that's where no CD comes in no CD is the world's leading provider of OCD treatment and it's covered by insurance for over a hundred and thirty eight million Americans all their licensed therapist specialized in ERP therapy and will help you learn to take the power away from intrusive thoughts in live face-to-face virtual sessions they also provide support between sessions when you

need it most so you're never facing OCD alone if any of the sounds familiar please visit no CD

in OCD dot com to book a free 15-minute call that's in OCD dot com okay you're on we are back so Ezekiel Toro wins this race if you're thinking man this guy seems to win a lot you'd be correct because in his last he did crash out of a stage race and didn't finish it but in stage race as he's finished he's won he's gotten first first first first first the last stage race he did not win that he's that he finished was the jury to tell you

a two or five six stages ago where he got second probably should have won so basically since last May he is a stage race winning machine where do you rank rank him in terms of current stage racers and what should we expect from him at the Tour de France he's one of the top three four

“best days race and I think you know you have we have Pugachar and Vinguart and and then they'll”

they'll totals there with some others but I would say he's probably in third position right now especially because okay Seixas we don't know yet you know Seixas has the potential but he's won let's say only two of the boss country for the moment it's only nine he's only nine 18 years old he's only nine years old yeah he's only 19 years old but so that Toro has advantage

I mean he has it's Palmaris is already incredible in terms of stage races and you can say well

you know who else is up there you have Felix Gallo finished second in the zero I think that Toro's better definitely more talent I use so is not there as another that level or at least not yet the Rampco yeah Rampco definitely not in the Rampco has been I mean Rampco has won a ground tour tour Spain and then I was stirred on the tour but it hasn't won a single one

“week stage race so I think the Toro is better stage racer and a better climber then”

Rampco I think if you look at if you look at it potential wise Spencer I would not be shy to say

in the flat stages Pogaccia is in my opinion going to win the Tour de France you're not swinging

“your guard will once again be second I think and I can see the Toro in third place is going to be there”

with I mean it depends how hard he will work but you know he these guys just keep going nowadays you know that's if we look at a few years ago Spencer we had when when did

Adam Yates be what when was he third in the tour so that was the sense it was like started

and saying Sebastian so that's the tour that Pogaccia didn't win right it was it was a vingigart Pogaccia are Adam Yates correct now yeah now I'm down in myself for one second yeah yeah is that Jace Pogaccia broke his wrist in your imagination then vingigar has got her Yates Yates Yates and third and fourth yeah okay but anyway it was Adam Yates and third I mean yes while I win for them they'll they'll total is in my opinion a better rider in Adam Yates

and if Adam Yates was third when while working for Pogaccia then I can see they'll total definitely on the third spot in in the Tour de France what do you think I totally agree I was even this morning sitting down sketching out questions for you and one of them was do you think

del Toro can get third at the tour they asked him in the interview they said what's your role

at the tour he said full full on for taday as I am like I'd like you to try for the Pogaccia too he's like if if possible I will kind of he's going to ride full gas for a day for sure yeah and then he just you're right they just it's like what we saw from vism at the jury just keep going and it's good because then if you have a problem you have someone behind you and he's also

“that good that I think he can do work I don't think he can't beat Jonas right now especially”

my work so taday but he can beat everybody else well the thing what we usually what what will happen Spencer is the following so you have let's say just straightforward scenario in a mountain stage last climb del Toro is the guy who does the last lounge for Pogaccia Pogaccia attacks Jonas either follows or can't follow doesn't matter those two are gone and then del Toro gets in a little in the little group behind with guys who ride their pace you know the success

and rampco and lip widths and you know those guys their Toro needs a tiny bit of a breeder and he will just stay with these guys and guess what's going to happen when he get to the face he's going to out sprint them yeah I'll sprint him he's going to get probably get a tail on his too a bit a bit like okay finally turn out he could but you know a bit like what we saw

“began Zoli in the giro but at a higher level I think you know so so I could see del Toro on the”

podium the tour I totally agree I'm excited about the prospect I'm also excited that if he doesn't it's like that we get a third place fight between for the tour probably between del Toro Pogaccia and rampco having a pole hopefully if from Cogaccia I literally ran at it

and lift him in lip widths last year's their place where I forgot about who's on amazing

form by the way exactly yeah maybe best we've ever seen him so that's incredible it sounds funny that we're excited about the third place for the spot the tour but I'm actually pumped to see it yeah well I guess we're going to have to I mean we we probably we'll do we'll do a recap of tour Switzerland but let's wait until then until we see the well the level of Pogaccia and you know weather that's going to be any suspense in the due to France or not I think we will

know a lot after the due of Switzerland what I was about to say earlier in the show is the what dofinetatus is with the Paul success crashes it can be over like that you know we thought one thing we thought it was going to be a duel between del Toro and him and it's not it's over yeah it's it's shocking when you're fan it like whoa I didn't prepare for this like it could there's no guarantee that Tate just crowns us through you know you get a piece of gravel

on a descent and you're done like you can you can happen that fast we saw last year he crashes was that stage eleven and uh to lose like touch of wheels he's down he could go on but you know he could have broken his collarbone and that crash and then had been out so we don't necessarily know that it's going to be a Tate ahead of Fiona's situation but let's just say that happens let's say Tate is out and then those guys are going against Jonas there's a pretty interesting race you

got there like that's that's pretty enticing to watch not that I want something bad to happen I hope

how Fiona's finger guard came to the front the first time he was obviously he was not the leader

Roglic crashed out and he finally turned out second in that due to France it was not the plan for him to be the leader of the team so anything else undefeating before we quickly quickly go through

“one to expect oh I think I think that's it that's it that's with with with with predictions”

yeah very very quick so I love I love this new Switzerland so it used to start on Sunday so where you would have had two stages yesterday a stage today I love this we're letting the wine breathe it's not too much overwhelming us it starts on Wednesday it's only five stages it's all point to point it sounds a little janky like it's all circuit races but it's better for the riders in the teams because they can all stay at a central altitude location and just go down into these races

I'm actually going to be on the ground Friday and Saturday so I can I'll get info right from the racio on for Friday's show and very good Monday's show but we have you know it's Hilly Hilly mountain it Hilly to mountainous stage one and two also stage three there's mountains but it could be a sprint and then stage four is a time trial stage five is a pretty tough mountain stage like 4,500 vertical meters and 150k and it goes the the town where the UCI headquarters is

like it just kind of goes by the UCI headquarters my favorite life favorite people your favorite place you're going to you'll be at the VIP lounge at the UCI HQ for this I'm going to ask my friend David for a credential you see I don't boy let's not let's not do that but then they just go up and down it's a circuit they just go up and down the same climb and then they have a finishing climb but it is going to be a really hard stage who is your pick to win this tour so it's a land for

“short that I forgot charr yeah I think for several reasons Spencer first of all because he's the”

best rider in the world secondly he's you know I think he's coming into top shape and and then

thirdly or maybe firstly he has never won the tour so that's that's one that's missing from

his from his list so he will want to win that you while you were talking about that Spencer before it's used to start when dolphin a finished I had thought about this and I went back to and it's actually crazy to think and it was you know I don't I don't remember who made that decision definitely not me so probably my my team manager but my last year is a professional no no I did the dolphin the dolphin in the everyday I don't know if it started on the last day

if it started I then I would have abandoned the last day and I went did the tour of Switzerland and then I did the tour of France oh my god and but I abandoned all three but the fact that I had to do dolphin a and Switzerland how crazy is that I'm sure you weren't taking a private jet between the two either no how crazy is that how crazy yeah who is your team manager oh you know he will know he will know that's such a bad idea it was it was a really bad idea

it wasn't really bad idea that shows you how that is actually good example there was like a

Tyler Hamilton video and he was talking about starving himself basically and you're like yeah no

one of these guys are going so fast now like but that's a great example but you just said like that's not very good preparation for the two of the friends it's uh it's uh it's somebody seems to have been that somebody seems to think that I needed more things out this should get

“I could totally imagine that's a conversation you gotta get the race in the legs it's the only way”

get the plans out of his room that's gonna take so much from Switzerland this is going to be the Pogacha show Spencer not going to be anything different so Switzerland they've they've served up a meatball here from Mr. Pogacha he's not going to win stage three I would guess but I think he will win four stages outside of that because stage one there's an 11 cake 11% climb average like three K from the finish stage two hello 1.1 kilometers at 11%

and it's at the end of multiple there's multiple climbs lead into that stage two there's two categorized climbs 1.5 K long at 9% leading into the finish line stage three it's two fly it's

going to win four of those and how's the time trial it's a flat or uphill 23 K long flat okay

“maybe he's not worried that the bending let's look let's look who's here for TT”

who interesting step on Stefan cool pretty much Roglic yeah Roglic is racing I know yeah interesting brand of it not too well the pool is racing by the way you're right that's not the

wonderful who yeah wake what's what's he doing here just trying to it's just not all

ration for the tour yeah yeah maybe win stage three maybe yeah that could be well he also could win now that okay now I'm kind of more excited about this than I thought like he could win stage two at 9% climb it's kind of similar to what was at stage two with the tour last year where it was him

Jonas and Pagachar sprinted it out they'd be kind of interesting all right all right Switzerland

“now now you've got our attention but that starts on Wednesday goes to Sunday I believe it's on”

flow bikes I think in the US so fire fire up this photo it is it by the way impossible to watch cycling in the UK I don't know what is going on here but just from a macro sense it's a little concerning like are they gonna lose this whole market like the tour is on TNT sports exclusively and I spent an hour this morning trying to buy TNT sports and I could not do it and it is very

“expensive it is shocking how the watching how hard watch cycling is here yeah not good”

anything else you want it it's not like there's Belgium there's a sign I can recommend you Spencer where we can all right we'll talk about it private yeah if you want this the ultra ultra membership is Johan I'm not going to guarantee that your computer doesn't get any vines yeah that's that's part of the issue yeah but anything else Johan before we take off I said I'm you know I have I'm leaving Marrakesh in one hour back to Madrid oh wow I have to go okay

get the private jet fueled up no it's isn't not flying flying I'd be able to express oh boy at least you're at least you're back in the Iberia family instead of that airline you food of Brussels two two two yeah two we three two they like land you in a separate quarantine terminal all right I'll talk to you we got we got there in the end so that's we did get there yeah it's a great weekend okay I'm sorry thanks you soon