54 seconds on his closest rival, you're honest with me.
Yeah, I think that was definitely, I mean, I close to a minute. So, in last time I checked you on, that's, that's a good amount of time. Isn't that, a minute? It's great, right, I mean, yeah.
“Yeah, I think the question before the start was, you know, my, my question was,”
well, that I forgot, char, take the stage and try to take revenge for his narrow defeat against Jonas, which was the last time ever that Jonas has won a battle against Tadee in 2024. Same, same final of the stage, same finish. Before the stage, I thought the answer was yes. And you know what, I mean, he can say, you know, who's not in my mind, after the stage,
he kind of hinted a bit that, you know, he had bad memories of that stage. And then, also, I think, you know, if we would look back now, he has done this systematically. Every single place where he was defeated, he has gone back and he has won. Everybody welcome back to the move. Plus, I'm Spencer Martin.
I'm here with Johan Bernier. We are breaking down stage 10 of the Tour de France, one by Tadee Pagachar.
I had a room co-evenable, never that second place, never in doubt, room co-had that the whole
time, Paul Sicsos in third, 34 seconds back, Florian Lippewitz, one of you, so Mattish Gama and Jonas Vindigard, 7th, 44 seconds back, big, big GC gains for Pagachar gains almost a minute on it. Jonas Vindigard in second place, 34, 36 seconds on room co-evenable in second place. So, big win in the Matthew Centrault, avenging his loss here from two years ago at La Lorraine,
where Jonas Vindigard beat him in a bike throw and will also preview tomorrow stage 11 and go through the betting odds. But Johan, before we do that, I want to go to my favorite part of the show, brand new feature we have is Johan's daily rant. Do you want to talk to us about the rest day, the writers had, and some of the hotels
they stayed in? Yeah, yeah, Spencer. I thought it would be interesting to have this new section. I don't think we're going to do it daily because there's obviously not daily. Yeah, we're just going to have to scroll in.
Johan's rant. Johan's rant. So, today's rant. Yeah, I definitely want to talk about, before we talk about the stage, I want to talk about some things I've seen on social media, some teams who have been posting the quality
of the hotel they were obliged to be in, like they're obligated to be in, buy the tour to France, the tour to France, and in most of the stage races, you actually can't choose your own hotels. It's the tour to France who decides which team stays where, and yes, you know, sometimes
you come into areas where the hotel offer is not amazing.
“I think in total, there's about 2,000 people who have to be catered to four hotels.”
But the images I saw of some teams of the hotel they were in yesterday and the rest. So two days, you know, the day after stage nine, and then the stage nine, and then the rest day was just from another level, you know, that wasn't the bad way, not in a good way, which is clear. You know, the hotel quality for certain teams was shameful, it's unacceptable, it's
very my opinion. Anyway, not that I'm surprised, this is not new. This has been going on for as long as I know the tour to France, I've experienced myself, as a cyclist, I've experienced myself as a team director and team manager, but you know, we are now 20 years later, and it's still the same thing.
So first I saw these reports of UAE Emirates, they were in a hotel, reportedly they were they slept in a hotel without any adequate air conditioning, the air condition was broken. And then they tried to, they have their own portable air conditioning units, they tried to use that, but that actually made the whole electricity system of the whole hotel, blew up.
And then I saw that luckily they are, they have their sponsor by H.L.E.P, one of our sponsors. H.L.E.P provides the riders with a special pot system that fits the bed, like a mattress and cools it down and lets them sleep basically in very good conditions.
“But I think that the sum of this was what you know X boasted on their social media, I think”
was it was Johannes Abba? No. Johanneson. I also bought his Magnus court. Yeah.
Yeah, Johanneson. Johanneson. Johanneson. Yeah.
And Magnus court, when his usual daily hotel review was very, very, very critical.
He gave it one out of seven stars, and I mean, maybe we can play this little clip here,
Spencer, why are we talking about it?
We see here that, you know, the first, it's Johanneson who shows the, the insects on the floor,
the cobwebs, no AC, a dirty, it was apparently a big apartment that sleeps eight people. So the whole, all the riders were sleeping in one apartment with different rooms. So then, as you see, they chose to put the beds on the terrace and sleep outside. That's how bad it was. Yeah.
So, you know, they were very inventive. And of course, you know, to the France, ASO, and especially Proudom does not like people broadcasting these criticisms and he went on record, you know, he said, you know, as a team, you know, exes doing great, but he was not amused.
I'm going to quote here, Proudom's interview is that if we want the race to visit beautiful
parts of France and have beautiful stages, it means that sometimes there aren't five star hotels everywhere. He explained how the two of the France shares, share out the team hotels. I was asked why we reserved the rooms for the teams. It's because we're the only ones who can guarantee equality amongst the teams on the tour.
At the end of the tour, all the teams will have the same number of hotel stars. They will have the same distance from the hotel to the stage. And from the start, from the stage, finished to the hotel in the mountains. All of the teams stay at the same altitude.
Only the organizer can do that because the teams will always defend their own interests.
I have really, really, really, really some thoughts on this, you know, in 2026 Spencer,
“I think what we just saw, it's unacceptable, it's ridiculous, it's shameful.”
I might opinion, but you know, if you look at having gone through this already many times myself in a past life, you know, then I see this, you know, this interview of Proudom, you know, my other favorite French friend, you know, who I personally placed personally at the same level of non-respect or my side as my good friend David Lappartyá, you know, and I have a question, you know, for Proudom, you know, because if you see Proudom,
at the start of the races, at the finish of the races, I don't know how to phrase this, you know, I would say walking around with an attitude as if he was Luis the 14th, the famous King of the Sun, French King of the Sun. - Yeah, we don't know what happened to him. - You know, I have a question for him, Mr. Proudom, how many stars do you have at the end of the Tour de France?
The team, the ASO direction for sure sleeps in hotels with great AC, they don't sleep in two or three stars, it's four or five stars all the time. I'm just asking this Christian for a friend, you know, what your star rating is at the end of the tour.
“I think it's really disrespectful and sport like cycling and especially the toughness”
of an event like the Tour de France should not be accepted that riders and teams are forced to sleep in these kind of circumstances with the extremely heat that's going on. It's already really unhealthy to do this. And then on top of that, if they are not able to recover sleep properly and rest, I think it's really, it should be illegal.
Question, you know, but I don't know what you think, Spencer. There's been this debate also that certain teams were trying to get organized themselves. The same as they have, they're organizing themselves to eat, you know, they have kitchen trucks, the very rich teams have trucks with a restaurant and dining room in it. It's been a struggle also to have that approved but for example, if Pugachar UAE has unlimited
resources almost. For sure, they have a very nice camper then with great AC, great bedding if they get to a place like this. And for example, only Pugachar would say, you know what, hey, I'm going to try to recover as good as possible.
I'm going to sleep in the camper.
“I think there is a rule somewhere in the particular rules of the ASO and the Tour de France”
that could disqualify him. I mean, in which universe is this possible? I mean, I would like to see, I mean, of course, you can't test it during the tour and challenge the Tour de France. I don't know if they would disqualify him, it would be, it would be really, really,
I mean, it would be really looking bad, but if you would challenge this legally, there is no way, in my opinion, that the ASO and the UCI could enforce a rider, not sleep in
His campervan instead of in a non-conditioned room.
Do you have any thoughts on that? What do the rules say? I wish I would have researched this more, but just to go through a couple of things there. So we're fair and balanced.
My pushback on this is always yellow on, but they're in the middle of nowhere, like
they're in the Matthews Central, there's not enough hotels that are nice. They have to do this thing. That's true. You always bring up.
“It's a very good point, what hotel is the ASO contingent in?”
And that probably is a good point, because they're probably always in a very nice hotel. So clearly, there are nice enough hotels. This solution, I think, has to be what you just said. It's the campervan, because there's not enough, no, there's not enough nice hotels. Like you go to some of these races, I went to this place I booked and it was like a
hovel. I was like, oh man, we can't stay here, and there was teams staying in this place. This was at our room. What was this? This is in Switzerland.
It looked like a abandoned shack.
Yeah, I can't believe there's team staying in here, but the answer has to be campervan's. And there, if we go back in time, rewind 15 years, do you remember Richie Port and Team Sky had a campervan for the year? Yeah. And then they would have, and then finally, Brails were ended sleeping in it, because it
was prohibited, that cyclist would sleep in that campervan. I think. And I guess we all accepted it, and now I am wondering, well, what is the exact rule that would say that you can't sleep in a campervan, and why wouldn't you be allowed to sleep in a campervan?
“I think this is the next step that has to be taken, don't you?”
Yeah, it has to. When that ends, I mean, this is a rant for another podcast and prize money, which is also ridiculous. Ridiculous. I mean, I've just saw a list of what the teams have earned until now.
It is, I mean, it's embarrassing, it's embarrassing.
Anyway, we'll talk about that in another podcast, but I'm always curious to see what would
happen if you legally test an imposed rule like that in a normal case. I think it out of law, where your civil rights are actually important. I think he would succeed, especially with the heat and the heat advisor, you could argue it's not safe, but the problem is you would have to test it, get thrown out, and then challenge it in court.
Yeah, exactly. Of course, you've been thrown out of the race, so it's like you win, but what cost would be the concern? Yeah, well, maybe you should do it with a, you know, with a guy who is already on the limit, and it's about to abandon.
It's not bad. It's not bad. Have him sleep in there. Yeah. I mean, the media on purpose, and have him thrown out of the race, I'm just giving
ideas, guys. If you look, if you're listening, that's not a bad idea. Revolution and a change. Because this feels like a layup, like, the people could do it, they could have can't prevent or sleep in an AC, which it sounds like we're complaining about creature comforts,
but with the heat that they're in, they do need to be in air condition. No, it's air condition. It's not safe. It is critical. It's necessary.
You know, it's like, how, how can you, I mean, listen, these images of Unix are just say it all. It's, it's, it's crazy. So it is UCI rule article 2.2.010 and all roadstages on the international calendar. Organizers must cover the expense of the teams from the night before the start of the fight to the final day.
There's must stay in the hotels provided by the organizer throughout the entire duration of the race.
“I think you could probably challenge that in court as you say, though.”
For sure. I mean, even if you don't sleep in the room, if you don't sleep in the room, but you sleep on the premises in a camper, you're still staying at the hotel. Would you be in violation of the whereabouts? I guess you just put that in your whereabouts.
A number unit number, and you just have a camper van as a unit number. Yeah. That is what they should do. I kind of can't believe we're talking about it. It should have been done like you did, but I really wanted to take the opportunity because
it's, it's, it's an embarrassment for the sport and it's really, really bad for the riders. And as usual, you know, they are pushed into this. I saw that there was pressure on on, you know, ex from Prudon, and then Johannason, you know, gave it a turn. He talked about it at the start and just, you know, said, you know, I was fine.
It was an adventure. We figured it out. Lamla, blah, blah, you know, it was too late to take up to take off the post. But it was not a great look for a so, and that bothers me that the comments of Prudon were very, very telling, because if you're going to put guys in a hotel like that, they should
be free to tell that story on social media. That's a little authoritarian, like don't, don't, you cannot post that online, because it
Makes me look bad.
It's like, well, then don't put me in a shit box. Okay, buddy. That's a little ridiculous. Just a point about that, but that's enough about that. We'll come back to it.
“I, I kind of can't believe they, but is that in violation?”
Because they didn't stay in the hotel, Johanna, they stayed on the, on the balcony. They get ding for that. Who knows? They'll get thrown out of the race. But forgotcha, our stage 10, someone could have looked at this profile and said, wow, it's
going to be a breakaway day. They look at all these hills, look at all these mountains in the Massey Central. No, it wasn't. I don't know if you noticed the star, but little trek super interesting. They have this strategy where they go so hard at the beginning.
It split the peloton. Forgotcha was caught behind. He had to break up by him, so I haven't seen that. I haven't seen that. Super interesting.
And then petters and sprints, they want to keep it all together for the, for the intermediate sprint, which is early in the stage, and they wanted to drop the other sprinters. They, they almost did, and they dropped him earlier. They drop a gotcha, a gotcha, makes it across. Petters and wins the sprint, super impressive sprint to beat Max Kanner.
Benjamin Groomy gets third, I'd be kind of curious to get your thoughts and if they would
be better off not doing that and just trying to send petters and in the move without other sprinters. Maybe that wouldn't work though. But then UAE just gets the front. There's all these strong breakaways going, like really, like flippogan is driving on the front
of the breakaway. And UAE just gets information behind and says we're going to control the stage. They control the stage. They get to the final few climbs, but the wheels start to fall off the UAE wagging a little bit, because brandyming notes he pulls off before he can do his work.
Isaac Del Toro's toward the back. He can't do work. Adam Yates is left to do a lot. And if Yates gets dropped, David Day peak in Zoli from Fizma comes to the front. So now UAE's not even on the front.
It's on the second to last climb and Pagachar, they go down.
I thought he's going to attack earlier, but there's a little descent on the climb. They're done with the descent and Pagachar says, okay, now's a good time to attack. He, Richard Caripass was off the front with a really good move, like 44 seconds off the front and Pagachar caught him in a kilometer before the top of the climb.
“Yeah, I think in 600 meters, Spencer, it's unbelievable.”
So yeah, no, that that speed, that difference in speed was crazy when he went. Yeah, I mean, I also, I was surprised, I thought he would have won earlier. But probably the team, I mean, I think he was counting on the old Toro, the old Toro must have communicated that he was not having a great day. That's why he waited longer, I think.
I think it ended up working out, so he descends, you know, the gap is not big, because he attacked right before the descent, there's a little bit of flat. If you notice that GC group is rotating perfectly, they look like a time trial. I was impressed, the little track got their stuff together, Mattish Gomo's of it was pulling really well, but they get to this final climb, which was not that hard.
It was 4.5 kilometer, sorry, it was, it's 3.5 kilometers of 5 and a half percent, but room co-evenables getting dropped on the flats before they even get there, evinables dropped. These dangling 10 seconds behind, you notice vinegar driving the pace, forgot shot, and then there's another descent, evinable catches on, pretty impressively on that descent. And then it's a kick up to the line, forgot your crosses aligned, 32 seconds in front of
the closest chase, which oddly was room co-evenable, because he sprinted past everybody on that climb.
Pulse exhaust, third at 34 seconds, flooring lipwoods, the other red bull rider at 34 seconds.
So two seconds behind his teammate, want to use so at 38 seconds, really good ride from him, and then vinegar at 44 seconds back, he was, he looked like he was falling apart, and then Del Toro who had dropped was 131 back, he's contrary to some popular belief on the move, forgot your did take some big time here. So yeah, he was only 32 seconds in front of evinable, but if you think about Pulse exhaust,
who is a very good climber, it could be a rival at some point, it's, he's 40 seconds. He puts 40 seconds into it.
“But it's almost a minute in the universe, 54 seconds on his closest rival, Jonas, I think”
that was, that was definitely, I mean, I close to a minute. So, and last time I checked you on, that's, that's a good amount of time, isn't it? A minute? It's great. Yeah, yeah, I think the question before the start was, you know, my, my question was,
will that Apple got your take the stage and try to take revenge for his narrow defeat against Jonas which was the last time ever, that Jonas has won a battle against today in 2024. Same, same final of the stage, same finish. Before the stage, I thought the answer was yes. And you know what, I mean, he can say, oh, no, that was not in my mind, after the stage,
he kind of hinted a bit that, you know, he had bad memories of that stage. And then, also, I think, you know, if we would look back now, he has done this systematically
Every single place where he was defeated, he has gone back and he has won.
For example, complu, where he was, where he got his ass kicked in the time trial. Yep.
“He did that in the до final last year, same finish, same climb, remember that?”
Yep. Yeah. Yeah, he's doing that, you know, like, well, you know, Turmale, that was, I mean, he won that stage. So, but he didn't do that. He didn't have the same attack.
I mean, he did it, he did it last year on, was it, was it last year called the Lannos? Yeah, what? Called the Lannos? Yeah. Where he lost like six or seven minutes?
All right. He still needs to win that one though. He did get away from, I mean, he, I didn't win because it was Ben O'Connor, who won that stage. But yeah. Yeah.
And he, yeah, and I was at the end of the tour and he was carrying that knee injury already, which we found out afterwards. But it was sometimes been open, it's heard on that. Nice. He's been doing this systematically.
So, also the time trials until now, since his defeat, against Jonas, he has won the time trials, except the team time trial, but it's not really the individual time trial. So, yeah, I, I thought he would do this and the plan, then if you listen to the team directors, you know, their plan was to go for the stage win, which was clear as soon as Tim Wellons and Groschardner started to put the pace and kept this break away, you know, whatever was the
remainder of the break away like a minute, 50 seconds, okay, it was clear that I was a little bit doubting when I saw the gap, kind of past getting that gap to a minute on, at the bottom
of that, on that last climb, him, he, kind of pasted it amazing right by the way, yeah, because
he told that he basically doubled it on the descent. Yeah. That was an, that was an amazing, amazing attack, and yeah, unfortunately, that they had other thoughts.
“I think that, who was really remarkable also was to see the difference in speed, when”
he called Karapas, he just flew by, it was 300 meters to the top, Karapas had no chance, like no chance this day, they on the wheel to get on the wheel. Which is kind of crazy, that guy's a grand tour winner, you know, he flashed on the podium in a tour to friends that Pagotchard won, if I'm not mistaken, yeah, he's one of the zero, was second and the 12th time third in the tour.
And it looked like when Pagotchard came by, and there was no chance that he could have held us, we had no chance, but 300 meters to go, shocking how fast he was, Johan, it was this boring. This is a big debate in the studio. Is this boring or exciting?
I don't think personally. I mean, for me, the race, the stages are not boring at all, I mean, listen, I mean, what's clear is that we kind of know already who's going to win the tour of France, unless something really unexpected happens.
Which we have to say is always possible, still, you know, we still have 11 stages to go.
But we kind of know who's going to win the tour, you know, what is it now, three, wait,
“let's see, three, six, up on 136, on Jonas, yeah, 406 on Rampco, I mean, I think we're”
going to, we know who's going to win, I mean, I think after today, surprisingly, we thought it was going to be a battle for the podium, but surprisingly, I think the battle for second is wide open. In my opinion. Well, yeah, that's the big question, because Jonas did not look good, also, if you just
isolate, so pergotter's number one, just isolate the best climbers in this race. So Jonas, three, 36 back, Paul Sicsos, 435 back, lipo, it's 444, so those are some pretty big gaps he's done in 10 days, but to me, the thing that stood out is to think that back two years ago, that Jonas won on this stage against Pugachar, and then how much better Pugachar looked today, and how much Jonas looked like he was struggling.
I mean, what do you think he's going to hold on to second or something, going to knock
him off this podium? I mean, you know, Jonas, I think for the moment, we still have to consider him as the main candidate for second place. Personally, I don't think he's going to be in a position where he can challenge the Pugachar, I've seen some calculations, Spencer, from somebody, I don't remember the exact
source, but somebody has done all the calculations on the climbs, and that he has been consistently on all the climbs in this tour. He's been 0.4 or 0.5 watts per kilo better than Jonas, that's, at that level, that's
Huge, that's huge, you know, I don't know if that feels right, but can that r...
right on the tourmalais, if Jonas was only 30 seconds behind, because in that would mean, forgot, yeah, but I love it, let's go with, let's go with it, because it feels right.
“Well, I mean, obviously, listen, I mean, I think the overall performance, if you look,”
you know, like, when Jonas tries to match like on the tourmalais, and even today, he was not that far behind on the top of that last climb, but then he pays for it, and Pugachar
just keeps digging time, yeah, you know, yeah, it's, which was incredible on the tourmalais
stage, and today again, you know, he was, what, 13, 14 seconds behind on the top of the last climb on, what was it, Pymari, or no, it was, it was not Pymari was, another, it was another, I mean, something similar, the climbing attack on or the last climb. No, the, yeah, the last climb, no, the climb hit the act on, yeah. So that was Cole, do you, Pertus, Pertus, like, four to, four and a half K at a point three
percent. Yeah, he was not that far ahead, and he wasn't that far ahead, no value, other, no, and that, I mean, Pugachar had to do a lot more work than anybody in that group, but even if Jonas was a deriving force of that, you know, it was basically again, you know, a model of a model against Taday and Jonas for a while, but then when they got after the downhill,
“they got to the, I first of all, the downhill, I think Rampkel was doing the majority of the”
work, you know, he's, all of a sudden become a really good descendor, he did an amazing descent of the tourmalais, by the way, also second in the KOM, after Taday, and then in the descent of the tourmalais, and today also he, you know, he was driving it, but then when they came on that big road, which was kind of false flat, flat, false flat towards the bottom of that last climb, that was a huge advantage for those seven riders behind, right? Yeah, Rampkel,
Lippovice, Ayuso, Skiel Mosa, Jonas, success, success, yeah, I mean, that was advantage for them,
yeah, you know, in on top of that they saw him, and they, it was always 15, 17, 18 seconds, and then
what happens is they get to the bottom of that next climb, and once again, today takes another 20 seconds, you know, with, with a lot more effort in the legs individually, then them all together,
“I think that's telling. So, yeah, I mean, I, I, I, I wanted to just stop for a while, Spencer,”
and, you know, really quote of Jonas after the finish. So, Jonas, Jonas, it's all, I'll just, I'll just read it here. Jonas, when you go, I'll try that in another 54 seconds till the April, I'll charge our on stage 10, 44 on the line 10 bonus, but admitted that it could have been more on the shorter, puncture clients of the Massive Central, and then he says, I think in the end, it was not too bad of a day. I, I disagree at totally with that, shorter clients like this
is not what suits me the best. So, obviously, I had to fight today to come away with a smaller loss, like this smaller loss. I don't think it's that small. It's something that I can be happy with. Directors for Teve Mark Rave asserted that Visma are still here to win. I will keep racing as such until Paris, and they keep saying that Jonas is better in the third week on longer clients, which in the past, in my opinion, has been true. But in the last two, two of the fronts,
and in this in this third two of the fronts, that has not been the case compared to, compared to today, none on top of that. And then, I want, I want top of that Spencer, sorry, I'm starting to see the price that Jonas is paying off having none the zero. And even more so, Spencer, if you look back, he's now doing the Tour de France. He's done the zero in 2025, he's in the Vuelta, and the Tour, it's his fourth round tour in a row without skipping
one single one of them. Which to my job and my dad's out, you know? So, I think there we could potentially see one of the explanations where there is a little bit of lack in freshness and punch. And then, you know, add to that this mental state of, you know, this interview he did on the rest day saying that he was on the verge of quitting cycling because, you know, you guys talked about it. You know, in the podcast, the move, I don't know, man.
I'm not going to say 100 percent that I follow Bradley Wiggins' prediction that Jonas is not
going to finish the tour, but I'm also not going to say it's absolutely not true.
I can't see the freshness and the punch that we need to see from Jonas to be
worthy rival for Pugachar. And then, on top of that, I also always look at their faces at the finish.
And it's the day again, there's a huge contrast between Pugachar and Jonas. Same as the tourmaless stage, same facial expression, really tired, really empty.
“He definitely gave it all, but I think it looks really good for Pugachar and not so good for”
Jonas to do in this tour of France. Well, we should also say the team, the Vismet team looks, they look gased, not just from the zero, but they use the smallest roster across all grand tours, which means people have to double triple up and they look like they're paying for it. They looked terrible today. Like Victor Campanars was a shell of himself. Yeah, Campanars is usually would be one of the guys who would be there,
at least on the second to last climb. He's not, I haven't seen him then.
Mateo Jorgensen has not done the zero, but he doesn't look his usual self. I think Mateo was dropped way too early from that main group when I think he got dropped
“actually when they got along. No, it was when, I think it was when Adam Yates was pulling.”
I think he got dropped. Then on 13th and after that, he also crashed in the downhill. After he got dropped. So that's obviously not good, but yeah, and Cepcus is there, but you know, he can't put his print on the race at any moment, you know. It's his forestreaker and tours, well, you know. Yeah, their best rider today, their best rider to stay with Yonos was Pianzoli, who's also kind of gased, I think. Yeah, after the zero. So, you know, when even, I mean,
what are you going to do? If Pugachar is that much better, and on top of that, your team cat match UAE is not much you can do except hoping for something to go wrong with Pugachar. And can we just investigate this comment really quick, because it's kind of correct. Pugachar is not as good on shorter climbs. He's sorry, vinegar is not as good on shorter climbs.
He's good in the third week. But if you go back to 2024, this is the stage that he won.
And beat, beat Pugachar on. And then he actually got worse in the third week. And Pugachar was gaining out like was putting time into him that whole third week in the, in the pierones in the out. So, I don't know if I think we can, I don't think we can really judge Yonos's performances in that to the front Spencer on his real value, because let's not forget that he came back from that horrible crash in the bus country. And three months later, he was performing at a really high level
in the Tour de France without having raced at all. I can't, I can't imagine that that was Yonos being regards best level. And he, I level. But he won this stage, not at his, he won stage. Yeah. Yeah. It's a little bit of a stretch for me to come out and say, oh, the stage doesn't suit me. It's like, well, you beat, Pugachar on this stage two years ago. So, maybe it does suit you. Question. Some quick questions for Yohan. If you had to pick a disappointment of the day,
what would it be? Um, I'm going to say Isagno Toro. I mean, Yonos obviously, because he loses almost a minute, but I think they'll Toro. I think the hopes were really high for him to be, you know, the third or the second best rider in the tour. I think today he did have an off day. You know, some people do struggle sometimes with after the rest day and not everybody functions the same way. And I think that the Toro has communicated during the stage that he wasn't feeling great.
I mean, you know, we haven't seen him pull at all. And then that's, I think that's also the reason why that they has waited such a long time to attack. And the fact that he's now down in seventh place is, you know, losing for the moment, the wide jersey to Huanau Yussel. You know, if you look on the wing of the street 36, Ramco is at 406. And so the Toro is now a minute behind the podium. So I would say this appointment of the day, it's not their priority. And so I think that that they
should race accordingly. I think they should not make it a goal for No Toro at all and let him recover, relax and just let him do his job and get back into the race.
“That's what I would do. I would not pay attention to, you know, if you're not on the”
podium, it's fine. If you don't have the wide jersey, it's fine. Just make sure that you're there, and then it's going to come automatically. So I hope for them that this was a bad day.
If it was, if it's a tendency that we're going to see, it's definitely not gr...
still not a huge problem for you. If he's not performing at the level, we expect him to perform.
“I agree. I agree. And a man, if you're ISO, success and lipo, it's you got to be pretty happy right now.”
Because second and third look like they could be on the table, maybe Ramco, this was the worst
he's been, he'll be all race, but to get drops in that climb, that doesn't vote so well for the Alps, I would say. But if you had to, well, I mean, speaking of Ramco or Spencer, I just want to, you know, point out also that although he did get in trouble, he said he had like a bad moment for two or three minutes, and then he fall back and sprinted to second place. This is typical for Ramco this season. You know, he's getting in trouble and he keeps fighting,
and finally he gets a pretty good result. We saw the same exactly the same India's best only, as for example, he was not in the top, he was not in the 10 best riders at all, not on a lot of dude, not on a lot of actual football. He fights back and sprinted to third place. So he's a fighter. I do not, I mean, I don't like what I saw today in view of the really hard clients we're going to get. I mean, like stills 15. Yeah. Just sell the song. That's all the
things. Yeah. Yeah. That's going to be an issue. Yeah. That's definitely going to be an issue. Well, for the moment he's in third, he is up on lipowits. And yeah, I mean, I would be curious to see I don't think it's going to be an issue because the time trial is after Plato de Salasón. Yes, yeah. If the time trial would be the Olympic appointment, that then that puts Ramco in second place in G. C. If the time trial would be the next Olympic appointment.
Well, in it's still good, right? We should maybe he has an amazing day on stage 15 and he isn't second place after the time trial, but then at least we know he's passed like a big mountain test. Yeah, back in, I guess. Yeah, but also Spencer, you know, we're talking now about today's stage and, you know, the differences and, you know, the still the relatively small gaps we've seen today. And I say small because for a reason because the toughness of the
day stage compared to the incredible mountain stages we still have in the studio France is nothing. Although it was 4,000 meters of climbing, but man, these upstages are hard, man.
Yeah, but the gaps are never that big in it. They're never that big on the big mountain stages.
Yeah, yeah, you know, it's like smaller gaps the harder the mountain stage usually. Yeah, yeah, I mean, you know, we'll see. I mean, listen for the moment, I don't think I want to put that chart should worry about that. I have the impression Spencer, I don't know what you think is that Pugachar is just riding his race and UAE are riding their race and they actually do not worry or bother, but not even about Jonas. They don't worry. They don't bother about their rivals.
They're just executing their plan and it doesn't really matter because he just, he's just a step ahead of everybody. So clearly that it doesn't really matter if they have to be wary of Jonas and the rest. Yeah, yeah, I don't think he's, I don't think I don't want to put words in his mouth. I don't think he thinks it's a rivalry with Jonas. I think he's just doing his race and if he's ahead,
“he's ahead. Just like as an example, plateaued a by 2024, you remember that is this unbelievable”
domination from Pugachar. He put 39 seconds into Jonas on that stage. You know, nobody at the time was saying, well, he only put 39 seconds on the Jonas. Maybe that wasn't worth the effort. You know, that is about 30 seconds to a minute is about what you see on big mountain stages at the biggest gaps. Even if it was back, I thought it was more on plateaued a day. It's a common. I'm studying this at me and some doctors at Harvard are studying it. But people,
they have a like a phasia in terms of mountain stage gaps. You always remember them being bigger
than they were, but especially in modern stage racing, if you go back and even if you look at Jonas at the zero, like not big gaps on these mountain stages, usually it stays like this where the bigger gaps happen. But if you had a bigger winner of the day that was not literally the winner,
“who would you pick? I'm going to say Paul's success. I think Paul's success passed an important”
cap today. You know, we're getting into the middle of the of the race now. He's not race ever for such a long time. And especially, you know, the way he performed today after a rest day
In the central Massive was really, really impressive.
I find it really telling that the team, his team took initiative, took the initiative. They were they were the people who started to when when UAE was pulling. Decathlon took over. And this guy,
Nicholas Prudon, was amazing. And that was at the instruction of Paul's success. We've seen him,
them communicate together. So he must have felt really good. And he finishes third on the stage.
“Very solid. Never in problems. I think today is success passed in a important exam.”
And I don't know where he's going to finish. Or if he's going to have a bad day or something at some point, but today was definitely a confirmation of his unbelievable talent and his big engine. I agree. I led you into that question. I wanted you to say that. I was super impressed with Paul's success. And this is again, like, he's kind of under the radar. No one will really point to this and be like, wow, what a ride from that guy. But it, it was. I was so impressed with that. Like,
that what happened to Del Toro is what you would expect to happen to a young writer in their first
tour after a rest day, right? Exactly. Yeah. And man, success. He looks confident too. He looks good. But let's take a quick, mid roll break. Let's take a quick ad break. And then we have some lesser questions and we'll preview tomorrow stage. Everybody this episode is brought to you by Tafosi optics. July and August are prime writing months. And if you follow the racing, you'll probably know how much the right I wear matters on the bike. Tafosi makes performance cycling sunglasses
for serious writers who want features that matter without the premium price tag. There's cycling lineup includes photo tech lenses that adapt as light changes, interchangeable lens options for different ride conditions, a reader models for checking your bike computer or route details and prescription ready options for writers who need vision correction like myself. And you can see, I'm wearing these photo tech lenses right now and they do adapt to light changes. So whether you're
watching the pros and July heading out for your own long summer ride or getting ready for the next grand tour to Fosci give cyclists real performance clear visions secure fit and strong value. So go to Tafosi optics dot com slash discount slash the move and use promo code the move to get your
discount today. Okay, Johan, we are back. First question from the listeners. This is from Matt.
He loves the move and the move plus. He says we already know that Spencer and George are feuding. He's kidding, but seriously, why do the guys on the move continue to have such an issue with UA and progress tactics. Cycling has changed a move on, moved on from the days of the past.
“Taday had the opportunity to take nearly a minute today and he took it. Why wait until later?”
What happens if he gets another knee injury and the third week seems to me that Taday is riding very intelligently and well with his limits. He sees opportunities to take meaningful time and he takes advantage. He's just that much better than everyone else. Johan, I'd love to hear your thoughts on this wire lance Bradley and George not down with the tactics up today. I don't know. I mean, I think the tactics up today. I mean, I think I predicted yesterday
and outcomes. No, that forgotcha was going to win. Yeah, I went and bet on it and it worked. Yeah. Today, it was no surprise. I think this was this was written this stage with that forgotcha and UA written it not over it. Especially if you see, you know, when they in the final of the stage, you know, you have these six UA guys. And then I tried to count and I think it was somewhere between 35 and 40 riders all together in that group. I didn't get the 40 but
but six guys still. It was only Nils Paulett and Florian Vermeer should not. We're not there anymore.
“So they do have the manpower to do it on a stage like today. I think there was nobody in the”
Peloton having any doubt today that UA would call for the stage when so I think today made sense. They, after the rest day, opportunity to take time finally gets almost a minute on your main rival wins the stage gets completely easy. It's coming out. 24th stage win of Pugajara by the way in the two of France and now two days which will be controlled by sprinters. You know, I've seen a stats somewhere. I don't remember who it was. It was a rider who published his stats from one of
those sprinters stages where they basically is pretty flat. They're sitting on the wheel all the time. And I think his average heart rate was 94 during the whole stage and I think it was Michael Valtgrin actually. I think maximum heart rate 1442 or something average heart rate 94 and in one
Downhill his heart rate went down to 44 beats per minute.
opportunity to recover. You have the stress of the beginning of the stage a little bit, although you know in these flat stages intent to see one or two people who want to attack there's not even a fight to get in the break away. And then maybe at the end your heart rate goes up a little bit
“because you have to follow the wheels and because they're riding at 60, 65 km/h but even on the wheels”
it's still relatively easy. So yeah the next two stages will be recovery days for UAE. You know, if the hotel rooms don't kill them. Yeah exactly. The mold but even on a serious note I don't know why those guys were pushing back so much on it because
time taken now is valuable because you're you're basically opening an insurance policy
for yourself because what if you get sick in a weird hotel room, what if you hurt your need like last year it just means you don't you're not putting so much on the house. It can just you know if I just want to follow wheels in the last week because I'm not feeling great. I can like it seems especially with the rest day and then the sprint stage is coming up. You mentioned you got his 24th stage win. Do you know where this puts them all time in terms of two or
“defense stage wins? So you have Cavendish, you have Eddie Merck's Cavendian, Cavendish 35,”
Merck's 34 wins. Bernard, he'd almost be somewhere up there also at 28 stage wins. 28, is he in
fourth? No, there's a guy named. Andre Lyduk, 25 stage wins. Andre Lyduk, 25 stage wins. Andre Lyduk,
he's so he's in fourth for now. Yep, we got yours in fifth, 24 stage. Oh wow. Wow, he's at the end of the two are he's going to be in fourth. Yeah, exactly. And then, you know, Lance Armstrong, we had 22 tied with Andre Lyduk. Yeah, you have pretty pretty good rider at the two where I guess who would have thought Andre Durant, Durant getting, do you know this guy? That he got from him. That he got it. Only the 60's, Durant. Yeah, he was a sprinter.
And then, I mean, the 24 stage wins is a lot to put this into perspective. Let's, like Freddie Martin, he said he won eight stages at a two or two fronts. He's 13th with 15.
So we got you're almost as 10 more than him. Yeah, so kill 14 all 14 wins.
Zobl 12, Peter Sagan 12, in Durant 12. And those are very good riders. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. Well, he's, he's from an, an Asian and other league sponsor. He's, he's just, just in a way, head and shoulders above everybody. We've said it already many times during the season. Well, I'm still, you know, we tend to forget Spencer that, you know, this is the two of the fronts. He is so much better. But he's been so much better. Every single race he has
tried to win this year. Classics, cobbled stages, cobbled classics. Les Bastondias, Milan San Ramo, Strada Bianca, I mean, anywhere, anywhere. And, you know, we're, then we're going to finish the two of the fronts. And then he's going to go for the world. He's probably going to win that two. And then Lombardy, I guess. Lombard. Yeah. I mean, he started 26 days this year. In the only race as he's tried to win and not win, where we're, we're Perry Rubey. So that's one.
And then you'd say, stage two of this tour. But he gave that one away. Yeah. So I, and then I guess maybe stage two of the tours. What's the one where he couldn't close the gap to the break away. So let's generously say three, three stages. Three races this year that he tried to win and did not win everything else. He tried to win it and he won it. So that's unbelievable. That's impressive. It is, it is unbelievable. Yeah. Well, we'll do more. I have another question, but I want to save it
“for tomorrow. So we can get to tomorrow's stage preview brought to you by next bet. If you want to”
bet on the stage, go to nxtbet.com/betoutcomes. They'll show you how to bet where you can bet how to sign up. And most importantly, the best price on each book, for example, to win that don't do not bet on this is a terrible price. But to, for God's years now, mine is 2,000 to win the two of the fronts overall. Kind of the more interesting. My white jersey pick now looking so great, by the way, maybe Paul success or even wanted you. So what's the one to do there? Mads Petterson for the
point. He's a minus 2, 10 with Benjamin Gremide lurking up plus 300. That's kind of an interesting one to think about. But then my favorite margin of victory. Seven more than seven minutes is now minus 1, 17. Five minutes to seven minutes is plus 1, 13. That's kind of what I'm thinking. Three minutes to five minutes is plus 2, 28. I don't see that. I think it's going to be five to
Seven minutes plus between five and 17.
pretty good. So that would be the one I would look at. Also, I've changed my betting strategy for the zero where I would just vote wait until I knew Jonas was going to focus on a stage. And then I would bet on that for Jonas to win and it worked out fantastically. This tour I've been betting on every stage for the purpose of the show much harder to stay positive. Like, I just if I really was trying to make money, I would just pick the stages I knew. But got char was targeting like today's
stage. And you can actually make a pretty good return on that because guess what he wins, as we said, almost every time he tries. Remember though, only bet what you can afford to lose tomorrow, though, stage 11, 161 kilometers starting in Vichy Vichy, which is a famous Vichy, the water government. Yeah. No, the water. Do you know Vichy Katala? No. Vichy. I mean, I don't know if that. No, it's actually I don't think it's the same water. I don't know if it's a collab or the government.
Okay. Yeah, it's not. I don't think it's the same Vichy. Okay. No, there's there's a famous water Vichy water, which is a bit like, you know, it has a lot of minerals, a bit salty, it's a bit, you know, it's it's a sparking water, but I don't think it's from there. We do go to Avion later. Oh, a time trial is. So that's, that's water there too. Yeah. Yeah. It's the water, the tour to Aqua this year. But 161 kilometers, not really that complicated, probably going to hit
“some heart rates like you just said, I think it's going to be one for the sprinters. If we look at”
the odds right now, it's Tim earlier is minus 190, all of COID plus 350. Yes, perfil of some plus 800. Benjamin, my plus 100, max cancer plus 1400, keep an eye on max canner. He looks pretty good. Who do you think is going to win the stage, you're on? Mm-hmm. You know, normally I would say dimmerly at based on what we have seen the way he has, you know, been catapulted basically, passed everybody in the last 300 meters. The two stage wins. He had the last two sprints
stages. So I have one reservation, you know, we're starting to get deeper into the two of the fronts and then merrier famous for winning early stages. And also he's been suffering extremely badly in the last two stages. Today and yesterday he was one of the first guys dropped. Of course, has teammates with him. But man, today he came in at 41 or 42 minutes. The time cut was, I think, just under 45 minutes. So I don't know if he's been riding in that little group
all day or if he was part of a big group and then just let them go on the last climb. That's also
a possibility. But he's he's been suffering. So for the sake of not always picking dimmerlier,
I'm going to go Olaf Koi because I think he's solid. Probably he hasn't been suffering so much as Merlier and other sprinters and Olaf Koi for the win. How much is he? Plus 350. So if you bet $100, you get $350 profit. If you look. I'm going to bet on, man, the timmerlier thing is you can imagine him winning this and us feeling pretty stupid. But there will be a point. Timmerlier expensive now.
“I think you should pick the Merlier. We have to hedge our chances. I'm going to Timmerlier.”
He will not win now, but I'm going to pick him at minus 190. If we want to keep it within the move plus, I think you should pick the timmerlier. I'll pick Timmerlier. He's a class printer.
Sprinter sometimes. I'm picking him for not always picking him but these guys have always
a trick on their sleeves and they can get something out of the bag when everybody thinks they're done, you know. Yeah. And I mean, if you think back to the Benny Amir two years ago, you know, he just kept winning. It does happen that the guy with the hot hand just keeps winning stages. Not unusual to get three stage wins at a tour for a guy that wins the opening ones. But also just to even as a pushback on, yes, he's been getting dropped early. Yes, it's been
miserable for him. But he's not been, some of these guys are putting big efforts into contesting the intermediate sprints. It has not been doing that. So, you know, he's just sitting up as soon as they start going for it. And, you know, maybe he saved some energy that way.
But I think he's still just writing his face. That's for sure. You know, he's never been
alone. Also, never been alone. Yes, that's true. So, I'm going to go Timmerlier minus 190.
“Okay. And we have a momentum trivia before we go. So, if you want to play this game,”
go to Ventim Racing.com slash the move, enter the question of the day. And if you get it right,
You're entered to win a raffle to in $5,000 worth toward Eventembike.
on the final day of the two to France on the move on July 26. So, that's Ventim Racing.com slash
“the move. You can use code the move 10 for to get 10% off on the site while you're there if you”
don't want to wait. The last question we had was the who was the last French writer to wear the yellow jersey in their debut race. Do you know the answer to this? I was not in that race, but I've watched that race. I'm going to say 1992, young Richard Vironk. Yeah, exactly.
“I can remember the stage. I think it was in the bus country and he was away with another Frenchman.”
I think Christophe Marjan, who won the stage, I think, and Richard Vironk was second. He was
riding for a French team called RMO and took yellow. Oh, wow. It's a big deal in your first tour. Impressive. Yeah, shout out. Richard, Richard. But the question for today is it was best deal day at the tour. And the best deal day is totally gotten run over by this new style of racing where people just try to actually win the stages. Sorry, best deal day. But they did have a good finish though,
Paul six Austin third. Like, that's a good finish for best deal day. It's not all about the break away,
but in the 2003 edition of the race, best deal day fell on stage nine, finishing in gap. Lance Armstrong did not win that stage. But what iconic moment occurred during the final descent? I think people will probably remember this. Yeah. I remember one stage. I remember who won that stage. You know, that's not the question, but I'm going to guess because I'm not sponsored thing. Was it Alexander
“Vinacurov? Exactly. Yes. Yeah. As we know, it's remember that I was like Christmas. Yeah, that was a”
great win from Vinacurov. All right, Johan, do you have anything else? No, I mean, did you say that they can write with their questions to info at oh yeah. Team info at we do that team. I can't guarantee that we'll answer your question, but we will try to get to it. But yeah, [email protected]
