What Is Visma's Plan From Here? | TdF 2026 Stage 6 | THEMOVE+

You know, here's a guy who got third last year and he was very, very clear about it.

He says, "Pugachar, that's not even try. We all know that Jonas is also better than us, so this is a race for third."

“You know, and I think that's really what he said.”

That's what he said. That's what he said. Yeah. Yeah, and you know what? I mean, we can speculate and calculate and try to guess and make these all these theories. But as long as we want, there's nobody better to judge how the situation is than these guys.

I mean, I have not seen Spancer a single rider in the pre-race interviews who did not say that Pugachar was going to attack and go solo on the tourmalais. They all know. They all know. You know, it's like we can try to find, you know, little weaknesses here and there. Or what if what happens is what if this happens? Nothing happens. It's just that you are going to the front and killing everybody and then Pugachar takes off. That's what happens.

Everybody, welcome back to the move plus I'm Spancer Martin.

I'm here with Johan Berniel, as always.

And we're breaking down stage six of the Tour de France massive day through the beer knees over the coldest spot. Over the tourmalais up to a brand new summit finish that people thought was going to be. I think Bradley Wiggins quote was it's going to be a limp finish. Was anything but Taday Pugachar destroys his competition drops everybody on the tourmalais and then extends his lead with Jonas Fenigard coming in second two minutes and 38. Seconds down. Isaac Del Toro was teammate two minutes fifty seven seconds down with the same time as room covenopole Paul six us flooring.

The poets want to use so Mattish gum was a liny mark. Sorry. Chum was his last one in the group Martinez is behind him. It was quite the demonstration Johan.

“I think the gaps were even bigger because they didn't finish on top of the tourmalais.”

So I liked the stage. I liked the domination. I could watch it all day. I don't believe that it's boring. And then we will also preview stage seven at the end of this episode. But Johan, I'm dying to know what was your takeaway at the day.

There's only one takeaway of the day. Spencer, it's Pugachar's domination. And the way he is supported and surrounded and lounged by his unbelievable strong team UAE. It's not just Pugachar who was who we all know that he's the best rider in the world. But it's also not even close.

I think at least this year or until now, UAE.

We always thought, you know, if you're always been talking about UAE versus Visma.

And you know, before the tour we were talking with debating who has the strongest team. Slide advantage for UAE. We said, Matt, it's not a slide advantage. It's a huge advantage.

“I think UAE today was unbelievably strong.”

You know, when they set the temple on before the Aspa and then on the Aspa. It was just constantly elimination from the back. There has not been one single attempt for acceleration. Everybody was hanging on for their dear life. Yeah.

We already saw that on the other stage at Pugachar one with that shorter uphill finish. But today was unbelievable how strong they were. And yeah, I mean, I think they had this plan. This was the plan. Several riders set it from UAE before after the stage.

That this was the plan that they would go hard on the Aspa and then harder on the tourmalet. And then today with attack. Yeah, tactics are pretty simple, right? Yeah, it's very simple. It's okay.

I got a plan. Let's get a bunch of strong guys but I'm on the front. They're going to blow it up. We're going to have the second strongest guy in the race set up. There's strong guys going to ride away from everybody.

It was pretty simple. Tactically, young one. I was watching the race with a couple of guys that I recall dominating the Tour de France. Land time strong Bradley Wiggins and they were both up in arms. But it couldn't.

Oh, this is so boring. This is terrible. The race is over. Am I wrong in thinking A that I remember team sky being pretty dominant and putting a lid on things pretty early. I remember lands, punching people in the mouth very early in the race.

Am I correct in that assessment? And is this necessarily boring or is it super fun? I don't find it. I don't find it boring as a spectator. I mean, at least the way I appreciate this sport.

And you have one guy who's a strongest. I can really enjoy this destruction, this domination. I am more a pogachar friend than a Vigagar friend. I'm not going to hide that. But you know, if you want us to be stronger, I would enjoy it too.

You know, but, you know, I like it.

I don't find it boring. It's also Spencer. Listen, the way this Tour de France is designed. They should have known that this was going to be a possibility. If there's a big high mountain stage on day six,

there is a possibility that there's going to be destruction already. Yeah. So, you know, today you would say, you know, pogachar and UAE, they kind of had to do what they did.

First of all, knowing that pogachar is incredibly strong.

Knowing that the team is strong. And that their next big appointment is on stage 14. So, I mean, okay. The time for hours on, yeah, the time for hours after stage 14. No, I think stage 16.

The stage 16, yeah. Six, no, because it's so 14 and 15 or 15 are really tough. Some of the finish. Yeah. So, anyway, until stage 14, that's their next huge appointment.

So, they had to do what they did today. Unless there's another situation where you have somebody in the leaders jersey and you know that they're going to keep it. But anyway, the two-mile demand, the two-mile is the two-mile, and I think, and especially being, what was it?

38K from the finish, 36K from the finish, the top. It's such a hard climb.

“You have to take advantage of that fact that the two-mile is there.”

Because that's where you can hurt your rivals and take time on them. I think they did what they had to do. You know, if we compare the Spencer, but this is actually what's, what's a bit different compared to other tours. Let's just go back to last year's tour of France.

We had the first big attack on of Pogatya on Hota-Kamda was stage 12.

Today's stage six. And today he takes more time on stage six than he took on Hota-Kamda in stage 12. I'd remember he took two minutes, ten seconds on Jonas. And now he takes two, forty, almost on Jonas. So, yeah.

Well, I think that's true, and I think this course invited it, because last year there wasn't really any big mountains until stage 12, so you could prolong this suspense. But also, I think, you know, Hota-Kamda, that's just a big climb finish. I think it would have been smaller gaps had been a summit finish.

“I think they elongated the gaps, they basically spread the groups out”

by putting the descent and then that long, long, long climb at the finish. I don't think this gap would have been as big at a summit finish. No, I mean, it would probably have been more than what was it now. Thirty seconds right between Pogatya and Wingard at the top of the... Yeah, thirty seconds.

But, you know, you could say, well, it would probably have been a little bit more, because maybe you could argue that you could argue that he did attack, but he didn't go 100% full gas, because he still had to go 36 kilometers after the top. And, and Jonas did go full gas today,

because he wanted to try to catch him, right? But it would not have been two in its forty seconds. If the finish was on top of the two of my day today. I don't know. That was the most impressive actually.

And again, you know, there you see the real difference in how much better Pogatya is. That he takes from the top of the Galibia to the finish. He takes two minutes and ten seconds on your nail. In a man against man downhill, valley, and long drag, four, five percent uphill.

“I think that's the... that's the information.”

Okay. Turmale is turmale. You could see clearly there Pogatya was better.

Had an incredible team, incredible lounge from Del Toro.

Doesn't really matter if he has that lead out or not. I don't think so. But you could say, well, Jonas initially, he was, you know, he couldn't follow. It's typical like trying and look behind. When he starts to do that, it's not a good sign.

But for two, three kilometers, he stayed there at like nine, ten, twelve seconds. So initially, I thought, you know what? This could be interesting. But man, when it was like in the last two k of the Turmale, Pogatya just put the hammer down to 30 seconds and then the incredible downhill. I mean, he's Spencer.

He's better than everybody on the climbs. He's better than everybody on the downhill. And he's better than everybody on the flats. Of all his rivals. So he's pretty good in the Turntrails.

So you could say, maybe Ramko, Ramko's maybe better on the flats. But Ramko's not a real rival for today. I think. So yeah, I mean, it's barring anything unforeseen illness or, you know, crash or whatever,

We know who's gonna win this tour to France.

“But again, didn't we already know that before the tour started?”

Yeah, I was gonna say we probably knew that in June. People didn't want to listen to the truth, Johann. I mean, I went back to 2024, the Pyrenees.

You know, I think the first stage was 39 second gap between Pogatya and Vinigard.

The next stage was about 1 o'clock. It was like just over a minute. I think we maybe would have seen something like that. Had it been a normal summit finished, but this ultra long. This elongated effort just stretches the gap out because,

I mean, I guess the scary thought is he does the tourmalade about 6.7 watts per kilo. And that might have been him holding back. Because then he like hits the gas at the top, pulls out, like blows his gap open.

You also have to think Spencer, it's extremely hot. It's at altitude. You know, it might not be far off his limit. You know, but he was definitely not going 100% full gas. He was, it was a controlled effort.

I think, especially the beginning. He made that acceleration, made the gap. And then you could see that from 2.5 k to the top, he did accelerate to increase that gap. He still had something.

And how would you rate Pogatya aside? How do you rate these other contenders? You have like in the bubble behind you. You have Jonas de Toro, Evina Paul, 6 hours slip-a-wits. Are you so scumosa?

How do you rate it? Yeah, how do you rate it?

“I think, I think, you know, the most telling piece of information for me,”

Spencer, is the interview of Lippewitz after the stage.

You know, here's a guy who got third last year.

And he was very, very clear about it. He says, Pogatya, that's not even try. We all know that Jonas is also better than us. So this is a race for third. You know, and I think that's really what he said.

That's what he said. That's what he said. That's what he said. Yeah. Yeah.

And you know what? I mean, we can speculate and calculate and try to guess and make these all these theories with as long as we want. There's nobody better to judge how the situation is than these guys. I mean, I have not seen Spencer a single rider in the pre-race interviews

who did not say that Pogatya was going to attack and go solo on the tourmalais. Well, no. Yeah. They all know. You know, it's like we can try to find, you know, little weaknesses here

and there or what if what happens is what if this happens. Nothing happens. It's just you are going to the front and killing everybody and then Pogatya takes off. That's what happens. Yeah.

But do you think you agree with that assessment?

“Is Jonas the second strongest GST guy at this race?”

I think so. I think so. I think.

Yeah, I mean, he's been the second strongest for the last.

But it's a 30 year in row now. Then two years he was better than then Pogatya although we don't know how we can judge. When you it's the same thing also with Jonas. Jonas had this bad crash in the past country. So obviously he was not on his best in 2000 was it 2023.

Yeah. Yeah. Was that 2024? Yeah. And then when he's been at least one of the two strongest writers.

Yeah. Yeah. And then on top of that Spencer, you know, every race he did where Pogatya was not he way he has won. So it's pretty simple, right? Yes.

And all these other guys were there. All these other guys were there, right? In several races. So these guys know what's going on, right? And I think it's going to be a really interesting battle for the moment for the moment.

I think the interesting fact is that Jonas is in second but he's not far ahead. So somebody in that group of five, six, seven other writers will say, ah, he's not that much better than us. We came back on him a little bit. Maybe there is a chance.

That's number one. And secondly, we'll have to see if this Jonas vingigart is going to be solid during the next three, two and a half weeks. You know, we had some discussions about this Spencer during the zero and after the zero. Yeah, it's the ideal preparation, the zero.

You know, he didn't go full gas. I don't know. Maybe it's an impression Spencer. But and it's obviously also magnified by the fact that Pogatya is so strong. But I kind of have the impression that Jonas is really good.

But he's lacks freshness. He lacks freshness and he's not as explosive. And maybe that's the consequence of having done the zero. I don't know. I mean, you know, you can calculate and you can program everything.

But at the end of the day, these are human beings. And about the works and reacts differently than what the theory says sometimes. So we know.

I am just a little bitter, too, because I feel like for 30 years. All we heard about was that it's hard to do the tour of zero double. And then in the last three years, since Pogatya did it, which no one should ever judge anything.

Never learned any lessons from Tate Pogatya.

The now it seems the perfect preparation.

“So I think it makes you pretty tired because who else like pretty tired today on?”

So I mean, yeah, I was going to say, I already didn't like this. When I was surprised to see him. I was faster. Yeah. On the roster, I'll be for the start of the tour.

David I pick on Zoli. Really, really good writer, young, young writer, big talent. Did a great Giro. Most of it in support of the team and of Jonas Winger. But also tried to go for himself.

And did he finish top 10? Finally, I think he finished top 10 in the zero. Yeah, he did. He wasn't contented for the, for the white jersey also for a while. And when I saw that, I said, man, that's, that's not a good decision. Obviously, they had this last minute change with Welfan Art.

Not being able to do the tour of France. And they were short on some writers. But to put him, I mean, this guy went full gas in the Giro. There's no doubt about that. That guy did not save himself in the Giro.

And we're probably going to see him. He's going to be on a good level, but he's not fresh at all. He's going to drag himself through this Giro detail. I think. So, yeah, I mean, as you say, Spencer,

this thought they put out Charles who's done it two years ago, but that's not something that should be set as the new rule now. Then you can do the Giro and the tour. And you're going to be extremely good in both of them. I mean, Lance doesn't know how David David begins all the years.

And he just looked at the TV today and goes, who's that guy? He looks pretty tired.

Finally, there's something there.

He does like pretty tired. I mean, speaking of these months, speaking of, I too shocked by that decision, you know, and I could not believe they selected him for this race. But, yeah, begin to views my odd decisions.

What's going on with trying to get material, jerking something up the road? Yeah, and he gets dropped very early on the tourmelai. Yeah, yeah, I don't know. Maybe at some point there was a lot of attacking going on.

And then I saw Mateo trying to go two times in a move on these little climbs before the Aspa. And it looked like it was out of control. And UAE was in a bit over the place. But listen, I mean, you know, I mean, you know UAE,

ultimately they're going to get it together. If they're a little bit disorganized and it's chaos,

“you know, I think the only thing that they're going to accomplish”

if they sent jerking something in a break, they're going to piss off UAE. And they're going to make them even right out. Which I think can't be the other day when they, when they walked everybody.

Yeah, because they tried to get jerking to the road. I think UAE was pretty peeped about that. Well, I mean, listen, you have to try something. I mean, you know, this, this, I'm not criticizing Mateo. Jerking for trying, but also, I think it also says Spencer

something about the condition of Mateo,

because if he's supposed to be your second rider,

your last rider to stay with Jonas, that's not a guy you should send in a break. Yeah, I don't get that. Yeah, I don't get it at all. They thought it was not going in break at least.

No. Well, we did see the, I guess to push back on this, we saw at the dofenet, right? That was the dofenet. Mateo, I felt like his weakness in that race was climbing,

like hard climbs. So maybe he's the new that he's not going to be able to stick around over the tourmalade. Yeah, so we got to get the scrap to road. Yeah, but you know, I mean,

already Spencer, if you, you know, before I got the beginning of the broadcast, we had Peterson and reports, who I want to talk about, and Victor Campanars up the road, Victor Campanars, okay?

Yeah, you're in there,

“but do you really think that they're going to let you go?”

And then still, I mean, if that would be a pig on Zoli or a sepcus or, but, you know, campanars is not going to have enough time on our span to make it over the tourmalade. So he can, this is not what von Art, you know?

Yeah. And then also, I mean, I mean, I hate to bang a little bit on this map, but I cannot avoid the impression that some guys are still,

we're only 36, right? A lot can change, and some people, but usually what you see in the first week

Exactly. That's exactly right. But for example, I think Victor, for example, is not at all in the condition he was in last year.

Remember last year when sometimes one or two climbers failed, he was the guy with Jonas. Well, what did Victor spend his night doing? Did you like that?

He did the Giro, yeah? Yeah. I saw him on the Giro, I was thinking,

“how is he going to be at his best in the Tour de France?”

So we have Jonas, we have Victor, we have Beganzoli, we have Cepcus, for half 18. All these guys come from the Giro, and then maybe somewhat else. Was that Fini there?

No, I think it's 4-0 for Alcofine. So it's like Alcofine, Matteo, the other two chaps. Who's name? Yes.

Let's keep me. I can't remember it. Yeah. Alcofine. And then the Danish guy,

or the Norwegian guy. Oh, yeah.

First of all, I was just talking to...

Yeah. Yeah. But four guys from the Giro is, that's a lot of your team doing double duty. Well, the UAE has a few two.

You know, you have, they have Adam Yates. But he only did the Giro for like two days. That's true. That's true. Yeah, he crashed.

That's true. Yeah. Otherwise, he would probably not have made the two team. No, I don't think so. Yeah.

Yeah. That's true. I mean, they're very like innovative team. But I feel like today, we saw where sometimes maybe just doing the conservative thing is best.

But yeah, perhaps Matteo would have been dropped anyway. And there was nothing to do.

“Well, I think the biggest, this and the biggest problem is,”

in my opinion, if your leader is not 100% fresh, you know, if you're, obviously, you know, us is, I think, I mean, it's difficult to say we would have to look at the numbers. Do you think he's at the same level as the Giro?

Probably is. Probably. It definitely is not weaker. I'm just going to the spreadsheet I have with their power. And it probably was even more impressive.

I bet it's performed today was even more impressive, because he's doing like zero to tell you, some of it finished power numbers, not at the summit finish. Yeah.

So, yeah, I guess we shouldn't lose sight of this. I think we said this ourselves. The question is not, is Jonas too tired to win the overall.

The question is, is Jonas too tired to finish second?

Because they were not going to be tadipagotter anyway. So, none of this matters. But you don't want Jonas so tired that he can't finish second, because what if tadipagotter would have he crashes today on the descent of the 12th of the tournament?

Yeah. You want to be there. It'd be ready to win the race.

“But, yeah, no, I think Jonas is the second strongest rider.”

I don't, I'm not. I thought Delta would look like fingers in the nose on that final line. But he couldn't stay with Jonas on the tournament. And it's not like that. It's not like that.

It's not like they'll total did a huge effort. I mean, he did that acceleration, which by the way, I don't know if you saw the interaction between Pagotter and the total after the stage on the warming down.

Jonas thought they told the total that maybe he went. He was a bit too excited. And he went a bit too fast. Because initially, they went away with just the two of them, which is the two of them.

I haven't been saying in some podcasts that they would go away to two of them. Yes. Yeah, I remember you saying that. But so so yeah, so thought they said that he was a bit, he got a bit too excited and he went a bit too fast.

In that acceleration. But then he had some time to kind of take his own tempo and try to stay with Jonas and couldn't stay with Jonas sitting on the wheel. Okay, you're on the tourmalais. It doesn't really matter too much if you're on the wheel or not.

It goes slow, right? But yeah, I think for the moment we have to, I'm going to say that Jonas thing in order

is the second strongest rider in the race.

And what do you think of Paul's success? Listen, really good. Really good. I personally think it's a really good result. He was what he was for.

Fifth. If it was. In 19 years old. Yeah, it's pretty good. Initially Spencer, I thought that on the early slopes of the tourmalais,

I didn't think he looked very good. I was at the same time. That was a bit worried about him. I was a bit worried about him. But then he kind of moved up a bit by bit.

And when the acceleration came, he was there. And then he stayed there. You know, he was with, he was with Ramko. And. Del Toro.

And I use so and skill. And lipos. Yeah. So I mean, listen, it's that's where I think we expected him to be. Is he going to be the third strongest rider in the race.

Personally, I, I'm not sure. I think if you would.

But if you would think if you would.

If you would ask the total. Sorry, 6 us. His real feelings. I'm pretty sure he's disappointed after today.

“I think he would have expected to be with Jonas being there.”

Hmm. I mean, yeah. I'm sure you're right. I bet even if you even if he was with the onus, I bet he'd be beaten himself up for not being with Daddy.

Is that. That's mentality. Yeah. You know, that's I think it's a great performance. It's only stage six.

I am slightly concerned about how he's going to do after 10 days two weeks.

I mean, he looks. I mean, everybody, we should say everybody except Daddy looks on their knees. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

I mean, it's like it's, you know, it already at the beginning of the stage Spencer, you know, before we went to the big clients. And it was attacking here and there. You know, after five stages.

There was many, many like that man walking riding in this case. You know, you could see people really struggling. All the sprinters were getting dropped really early. You could see my lear incredibly in pain. And then on the other hand, we had, you know,

our good old Matt Spaderson in the breakaway. Victor Campanars and takes those 25 points, which, you know, is, uh, another 25 points in the back. Um, did you see that incident of who parts the guy from Lotto, and then the commissars?

I did. I was confused about what was going on because he was not signed for anything. Yeah, no, no. So, so yeah, I mean, nobody knew. I mean, I have these two pictures here.

Uh, you know, it was about the position and it's so called illegal position of his four arms. So if you look at the pictures. You can see that he is on the hoods and his four arms are resting on the handlebars. Apparently, that's not allowed. Um, and it's pretty natural.

But it's almost impossible to not have you have them lean on the handlebars, especially with the, with the narrow width of the handlebars nowadays. Um, and then I saw some information on TV also that, you know, one staff member of a team had sent 40 pictures of writers during the season, doing the same thing.

Uh, and at the same time, Victor Compton Arts was writing exactly the same position. It's exactly how he writes. So I was very strange to see this UCI commissar having a talk. Uh, we didn't really know what was going on in on the life coverage. And then he parts just, you know, went back to the, to the bunch.

Uh, and then afterwards, it was communicated that he got a warning. So not a fine and not a disqualification, he got a warning. And that out of protest, he made the decision himself to go back to the Peloton. Uh, it's apparently a rule that most of the writers struggle with.

“Uh, and so I think that, uh, I mean, of course, this is in the tour of France.”

So it's, you know, a life TV and it's going to be a topic of discussion. But, uh, it's very subjective also, you know, depends on who looks and, you know, it's a, it's a, it's not well-defined rule. Um, and I'm all for, you know, rules that could, you know, contribute to the safety of the writers. But then at least apply them for everybody the same all the time.

Yeah, and it's hard not to sit like that when you're on with these modern bikes. They kind of put you in that position. Yeah. On, on the break away on how the stage started. So Mads Fetterson wins the, he bridges up to Victor Campanauts.

He was, he was hammering to get up there. He would be easy to watch and say, why aren't all the spinners going up there? I don't think they could. I think Petterson was the only one strong enough to go. And then he gets the intermediate sprint point.

He now has a huge lead in the green jersey classification. Did you know that he got more green jersey points today than Tadipogotri did for winning the stage? How much was it? He got 25 for the intermediate sprint 20 for the stage one. Oh, only 20.

Okay. So right there, we can see like, yeah, it's going to be hard for Pagotri. It's going to have to be a sprinter. Yeah. Yeah, because he's a losing points on days where he's putting out some of the most.

Yeah, it's a performance as we've ever seen. So yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

“Well, that's obviously why they changed that, you know, point system, which I think it's, it's right.”

You know, I think the point jersey should be to a rider that.

When usually was a sprinter always until we had those dominators who.

I mean, Pagotri today takes the pocket of jersey also.

I bet he wins this thing because he's going to dominate on the climbs.

“I mean, yeah, I kind of like it too because it's like, okay, Tadip, you want to win the green jersey.”

You got to get in a break way tomorrow. You got to melt off. Like, you really got to earn it. You're not going to win it by accident. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Well, should we take a quick break you on and then we can come back and talk about any other. We'll talk about the tourmalade times and then we'll preview to our stage. If that works for you.

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And if you want to be like them, if you want to cover like Tate, go to lagoonsleep.com slash the move and take a two minute quiz. Use code move in OMOVE for 15% off lagoon, the marginal game gain you've been sleeping on. All right, Johan, we are back. So before we get into the twomelake climbing times, you want us to finish our was on a one by single chain ring today. What was going on with that?

I was surprised. I mean, I only saw it. I mean, I only remarked it on the top when they had like a side shot. And I saw him on the big chain ring. And I saw it was a single chain ring.

Obviously he's using the one by of SRAM with the 13 sprocket explorer. And apparently it's a 52 chain ring.

“I mean, you have to be minimum of 52 because otherwise you don't have gears enough on the flats”

to write 78 hours and then on the top. It was to 10, right? Yeah. Okay. So it's a pretty big year.

Yeah. So apparently it's 52 36 13 sprockets. I spent your eye, you know what? I mean, they must have their reason. I've seen most of the other business riders on a two by set quiz was on a two by.

I don't understand, man. I mean, it's it's for a stage in the high mountains with a climb like the two. Molly. Everybody who's on a, you know, we all, we probably all have one by is on a gravel by X, right? I don't know about bikes for sure.

But on the road, and especially in the really high mountains, these gaps between those. You know, like, yeah, 26 and back. Kind of get it. Then your next one must be a 32.

So as you will never get to the 10.

Now. And then the other hand, you have pogachar who's riding the classical Shimano system, which I suspect if it's a 54 chain ring.

You can't go any lower otherwise the gap is too big.

So he's on a 40 chain ring probably. But you do have these, you know, smaller, smaller gaps between the different sprocket. So the thing is Spencer, if you are, you know, if you are outstanding and you have an unbelievable day, and you have a one by it doesn't matter. But if you have your little bit off, you're going to miss that sprocket that, you know,

usually you would need to, you know, kind of take a little breather. You have no margin of error with a one by. It's either you, it works or it doesn't work. There is no need to be. Yeah.

“And so I was surprised to see because why would they do it?”

Is it because of, okay, it's eliminating the risk that your chain drops. Okay, I can understand. Weight wise, these bikes are now so light that they're, they're under 6.8. If they, if they really want to. Although it's an error bike, but anyways, it's going to be 6.8, 6.9 kilos.

That was the, the several, I think. Yeah, I would think because, you know, Colnago, like, we had, we had our spat last year, about if that's a heavy bike or not. And they told me they can get that, the, the arrow Colnago, they can get it down, like close to the, to the weight of the day.

So I had imagine the, it's a fellow could do the same.

And then it's, and then the third reason is, I really dynamics.

But, um, yeah, I don't know, I, I'm not a fan. I mean, I mean, I can understand if it's a specific, stage where it's not in the high mountains, even Spencer, I have my doubts. I mean, and this is not, not related to the tour, but I have my doubts. I mean, there's, there's quite a few riders on SRAM who have been using this

in the classics, like in tour of Flanders. Yeah, I have my doubts there too. You know, interesting. I kind of look at it on that.

“But yeah, I mean, you, you have to shift a lot.”

You, there, there's more risks to drop the chain and stuff, but still, there's also these gaps, you know, I mean, on those steep walls with the cobbles, um, if you're, if you have really good legs, it doesn't matter, but if, if you, if you're a little bit off, you're going to appreciate a double chain ring.

I, I, I just as an active journalism, I'm writing this 54 40 that you describe from the Shimano home every day, and we live at the top for the tour here. We live the top of a 14% climb. It is so hard to get up that thing. And I actually, I can't imagine not having the little gaps.

Like a few of the gaps in your hurting that much. It has to, it has to make a difference. I, I was, I'm just confused. I'm more confused than anything about why Jonas would do this. I don't understand it.

You know, he doesn't often. He, he seems to like it. He's done it on a lot of stages in the, in the, in the zero also. He likes it. I mean, I guess, I don't know, make it.

Maybe he likes to cross chain and that's a more secure way to do it. That would be the only guess. I'm not a huge fan, but anyways, you know, I'm old. I'm old fashioned and grumpy. I'm complaining.

You know, I, I have a double on my gravel bike. That's how much I like the double. So, okay. I'm the same way. I don't like.

I mean, I could, I, I mean, I have also double chain rings on my roadbikes. I mean, I would not, I would not oppose. I mean, if I, I mean, a single chain ring.

“For, for a recreational rider, I think it's pretty good.”

Yeah. Super super comfortable. You eliminate another thing that can go wrong. You know, if you're riding strong electronic. You're losing a potential spare battery.

If you run out of. If you run out of battery in there. Yeah. Yeah. But, but.

Yeah, anyways, this and I'm sure they've done the tests. And, and if you want us like it. You're going to keep using it, but. It was, yeah. It was, especially for a climb like the tutamale.

I think it's, it's, it's a bit of a risk. Well, the proof could be against this. You're on because the tommole, the climb they did today, the most, I guess the most prolific climb. The first climb ever into the front history.

The most prolific climb over the years. 70 K long. 7.4% average. That's a long climb for people like they don't know. They took, but got your 43 minutes in two seconds and for.

These top professionals for them to take over 40 minutes to do a climb. It is. So rare like you rarely even see climbs long enough for that to happen. Like if you are very fit amateur, like if you think. I could beat these guys like you're very that level of fit.

It would probably take you an hour and 20 minutes through this climb. That's how big the climb is double.

It's always a Spencer if it's always.

It's always. It is always. If it's a fit cycle to richs, just just multiply by two. I guess that's going to be your time. And you know, you know, you know, you don't have to go over very easy.

You say that there's a climb on the way into the studio where Matthew Ricka tell us the KOM.

No matter how hard I push, I can't get within. Double of the time. Yeah, but yeah, it's and I'm going hard on that thing. But so that's two minutes fast over two minutes faster than the record, which was set by Jonas Findigard in 2023.

So Jonas beats his own record. And eight, eight other writers in the group behind also break the record. So they were Find of that climb today. Yeah, I mean already.

“I think listen, obviously a lot also has to do with the running, right?”

The first 10 kilometers. Is you a E setting this pace. So that was already super fast. You know, there's only one. I mean, if these, once these big guys go with,

but what did Pogacha go with five six K to go from the top? Yeah, more. But anyways, there's only one way to not going to beat it. If if the leading is slow and tactical, there's not much going on. The fact that you were each just started straight away and just, you know,

burned one after the after the other, everybody set their own tempo. It was clear was going to be a KOM today. But but by over two minutes, that's, that's quite something. And that was actually Jonas and today crossing together. Because yes, yes, yes.

Yeah.

Ultimately, it was finishing Kothere and Pogacha one at stage.

That's a huge message. Jonas tried two or three times a big attack to try to drop Pogacha because he had dropped him the day before on the Murray block. Yes. Man, what a different time.

It's like hearing you describe like the invention of fire. Yeah, it's Pogacha getting dropped by Jonas. He owned his attack. It's only three years ago. I know.

I know. And then it was shocking when Pogacha attacked him one to Kothere. People were blown away by that. Yeah. But yeah, they were, they were flying up the climb today.

And it's not the interesting thing to me is it's not just, we all know Ted is very fast. He's going to go fast. But all of these guys, you know, we said every year that you, this proves it.

“You have to be significantly faster every year than you were”

the year before to stay competitive. Yeah. Yeah. I don't see Pogacha. Pogacha breaks the record.

Jonas breaks the record. The total breaks it. Ramco takes us. Lipo, it's their total. Are you so.

Let's get most all these guys broke the record. Yeah. Like if I just came up to you in the street yesterday and said, Ramco up in a cold evidence was going to predict the record on the tornado tomorrow. Yeah.

Whoa. He's going to ride away. I win the stage. Ramco was, you know, Ramco was pretty solid today after this. He was really good.

It really good. This, this was, this is a climb where two times he, he, he, broke one time in the Valtah. When said, could's one the Valtah? Yeah.

He got, you know, dropped there very early and then in the tour last year. I was also into the Maleno. Yeah. And today he was, he was up there. Didn't, I mean, he obviously got his own tempo.

Couldn't respond to the attack. But I think he looked pretty solid. He is so just a little bit more detail on his weight. You know, because so he is. Four kilos lighter close to four kilos lighter in the spring.

But he is one kilo lighter than he has, is ever lightest weight. Which was when we started the tour. Interesting. Yeah. Clean climb like it today.

He was very good. Yeah. Very solid, very consistent. Very good. Very good.

“Was that a very strong, very strong on the last climb also?”

Is that kind of proves the theory that I think, I think we had that he's not naturally as good of a climber because he just runs at a higher weight. And he has to be at a really low weight to be able to climb consistently with these guys. I mean, maybe, I mean, I think he's this, and he's a pretty good climber man. He's been like every stage race.

You know, the last two years. He just gets found out on these climbs. And then today it's like, well, where did that come from? Yeah. Climb like Dustin's 2024.

Yeah. He didn't look like he was, I mean, at least in the group he was in. He was either driving it. Because behind Jonas and Del Toro and who was the other guy was a little which was there with them. Lippo, it's not sex.

Sex. Sex. And then it was, you know, he was in that other group. Yeah. Yeah.

He looked pretty good. Let's say I think he's going to be, he's going to be pretty happy with today's result. Because I think it's going to be a big relief for him.

I think it was kind of a nervous build up to or was the first big mountain.

You know, to find out, okay, how am I going to be, you know, because the last experiences were not very good.

And now, so he's 330 back. Del Toro's 327 back. Jonas is 242 back.

If they went into the time trial right now, like not impossible that he would be second.

Yeah. So he's got, he's going to be feeling pretty good. Well, one guy we've now mentioned is towards the train. The yellow jersey to just trash it day in yellow. He gets dropped and he would have been out of yellow.

Anyway, he gets dropped earlier than I thought he would. Yeah. And we thought, well, he's going to lose so much time on the tourmalade that he's going to be out of yellow. And then he crashes into his teammates wheel, descending the tourmalade, which is not fun at all. Yeah.

“That was obviously, you know, a result of being completely cross-eyed, I think.”

Yeah, being very lucid. Let's not forget also Spencer. He also crashed yesterday. Yeah. So, you know, it's still to be me.

He was already on one of those little climbs before before the uspan.

I already could see that he was struggling. He was here. He was having difficulties to close a gap. So it didn't look like it was going to be a great day for him. Yeah, I was, yeah, I mean, we were wrong by thinking that he would keep his eight men of lead. At least some of them, some of it to stay in yellow.

And then until stage 14, but it's been a shorter yellow experience than we thought. To be fair, only 11 riders finished within eight minutes of pogotcha today. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. That's maybe the reason.

That's maybe the reason. Short and Jay got was eight, 18 back. That's a top 10 finisher in the two to four. That's crazy. That's crazy.

“And then, yeah, and so of course four to the ground for the certain way left.”

After the crash Spencer of Dorston train, look, it looked pretty serious at the beginning. He didn't move. I mean, he didn't make any intention to get back on his bike. Yeah. And so obviously, then he lost a lot of time more than half an hour, almost half an hour. Yeah.

Yes. And I have doubts if he's going to be at the start tomorrow. He was asking for like super cold spray on his shoulder on the last climb. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. That's that's not a good sign. And yeah, no, it's it's really like really sad. Not a great way to enter your time in yellow. Also, Jonas crashed yesterday.

I noticed last night when I rewatched stage. Yeah. Yeah. Let's preview stage number seven. 175 kilometers.

We all know we all know the stage like the back where hand. We got a sprint stage in the Bordeaux. Before we preview it, we have a partnership with next bets. In XT bets dot com slash bad outcomes. If you want to bet on the stage.

Definitely head over there because it shows you exactly how to bet. It shows you where you can bet and most importantly. It shows you the different prices. So for example, I can see the best price in the US right now. To win the two to Francis title, we got your minus 1400.

Should have gotten them yesterday at minus 550 or whatever it was. The points classification. Matt's better said minus 160. That's actually decent price for where that is right. Now, let's look at younger rider classification.

Del Toro's now minus 135. Should have listened to us two days ago when he was plus 160. But Johan, I'm going to look for the odds of this stage. But while I do that, I assume 165 kilometer stage with the least amount of climbing of any road stage in this race. 841 meters of climbing.

This has got to be a bunch of been correct. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I mean typical board those stage 175k. No, it is I think 175k. Yeah, yeah. There's one little climb after 137 kilometers in the sprinters.

Won't have a problem with that. So for sure, it has to be a bunch print tomorrow. Spencer, a complete bunch print or we don't know what's going to happen in the final. I mean, yesterday was a bunch print of what was it. 35 riders. But yeah, scratch.

Yeah, I mean without seeing the odds Spencer, I'm going to say the guy who's not the favorite. Because I know who's the favorite is on the on the bookmakers. I'm going to go for Olaf Koyigan.

“I think I think he looked incredibly good.”

Amazing great shape also physically. I mean, it's not just it's printed legs.

I think he looks like it is in the best physical condition of all the sprinters. And, you know, it doesn't really need a lead out train, but he will have to lead out guys. If you have downhill and case ball or safe ball, whatever it is. I don't know if it's case or sees. So yeah, I'm picking Olaf Koy for the win tomorrow.

Yeah, so the, I like that pick. The odds are timber. This is on draft Kings because next bet's told me that's for the best price was.

Yes, for Phillips and plus 500.

Benjamin, your my plus 900. Max cancer plus 1600. Matt's better than plus 2800. I'm going coy too. I think coy is the fittest sprinter. I rewatch last night's stick. I rewatch the stage last night.

He launches he gets a gap, but they don't pull him back at all in the last few hundred meters. Like he, it was Mark Cab, I'm going to say it again. It was Mark Cab in a Shask, just the acceleration and the ability to hold that. This guy is really fit right now. So I'm going, especially at the price, plus 200.

I'm going to love Koy plus 200. Yeah, and especially also Spencer, listening to both Merlead and Phillipson. Yes, today, both of them said that it was so fast. They were completely on the limit in like in the last kilometer. And something tells me, I mean, I just, it's just from observation.

And I don't know. I mean, I've said it. I've said it already. Think on one of the shows. I have the impression that Phillipson is not his usual self. That is normally in the tour de France. He looks different.

“He, I think he, of course, if you're a sprinter, you, you, you,”

I mean, you can't get away with being bulky, but he doesn't look as slim as the usual Phillipson,

who wins three stages in the tour de France.

I mean, you, you may try to win me. Maybe tomorrow, maybe tomorrow, I'm, I'm proven wrong, but my initial takeaway is that Phillipson is not in the same condition as usual. I think you could be on the something there. I, I wonder where Matthew Wendell's head is right now.

Because I would have thought that Matt Spetterson stage was perfect for him. He was nowhere. And then I wonder if he's just fully dialed in on the mount bike world championships. He's not, I mean, that's what he said. That's his big goal for the year.

Training camp, training camp. Yeah. Training camp for that. Did you know, eight, two-part question. Did you know Franandica Vierias at this race?

I saw that today, yeah. Do you know what his odds are for tomorrow? I mean, for number, it's been a while since Franandica Vierias been in the mix for a sprint in any race. I don't know.

Plus 10,000 plus 10,000. Yeah. This is a guy who was like seen as the rider that was going to not cabin the shop is spot. He was.

I mean, when he came on the scene. Yeah. He was on quick step. He won a couple of stages. No, in the tour.

Yeah.

“Actually, it supports our all-off co-opic because it was the same way.”

He popped onto the scene. He was so good. He won multiple stages. That tends to be what happens to the sprinters that come out of no, not out of nowhere.

But first on to the tour scene with a lot of.

Fazaz, they tend to win multiple stages. Yeah, he's on. He's a good hero. No. Yes, he is.

He is. Yeah, I'm going to say my wild card for the stage. Max Cantor plus 1600. I thought he looked pretty impressive. On stage.

Yeah, really good lead out. Three and also yesterday. I mean, I don't know. It was the consequence of the chaos that was. I've happened after the crash.

But he has a few guys. A few guys there. Although. I mean, I. Okay.

One thing is being. He was. Was he second yesterday? He was second. Yeah.

He was second. Yeah. Okay.

“And today he did win the intermediate sprint.”

Yeah. From the Peloton from. Yeah. Yeah. And he's got it.

Strong lead out. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I would be surprised if he wins.

But probably a good bit for the top three. Yeah. I think a minute. Yeah. Because he often does line in the top three.

So before we go. Ventum trivia. Everybody knows the rules. I'm looking for the rules. Answer the day's trivia question correctly and get entered to win for a chance to win.

A five thousand dollar credit toward a benton bike of your choice. The winner will be announced on air on the move on the final stage. On July 26. Yesterday's question was. Po has hosted the tour more times than any other than almost any other city.

How many times has it been featured? The answer was the answer from Ventum was 77 times. I looked this up though at 67 times. And which is a lot. I believe that ties it for Bordeaux.

But Bordeaux will pass it. When they finish their tomorrow. Today's question is. The cold to tomoli is the most climb pass into her history. When was the historic climb debuted in the tour?

Do you know that I do don't say it? No, I don't know the answer. I don't know the answer. Spencer, but I have heard the stories. That it was the assistant of the to the France director who went to.

Who had to go somewhere and he went over a pass. Which was called Tudymale, which was unpaved. Unpaved. So it was dirt uphill and downhill.

I mean, this must have been early 1900s, right?

Yeah. And so he said, he said, okay, I arrived, delivered the message. And we can pass here.

“And that's how the tomoli got included in the tour of France.”

Imagine this climb, Spencer. So we know how hard it is. So I mean, it was not flatter. It was the same steepness. But no, no paved road.

And it was bikes. Yeah, one gear. One gear. Yeah, I guess one gear. No gears would be your bikes.

I mean, I don't know. I mean, I don't know. I mean, back in those days. There was, I mean, maybe there was. Because there was, there was a system.

They had, they actually two gears. They had one, one sprockets. Like the men on the flop. And on the other side, they had another sprockets.

And basically what they did, they took out the wheel on the top of the climb.

And on the, they went on the, they turned around the wheel. The back wheel. And they had the other heavier gear for the downhill. That's crazy. But yeah, yeah, yeah, it was not on 50 years.

It was close. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Going downhill, things gear. That's. I actually cannot imagine doing the tourmalade without pavement. And without this gear. Yeah.

That's crazy. It is another, you know, another crazy. A few years ago, a few years ago, I saw this on Spanish TV a few years ago. There's an ex professional cyclist who I raised with. He was on Banesto and on Reynolds.

And he was one of the teammates of Miguel in the line. And for a good cause, he wrote up the tourmalade backwards. Oh, my God. So, so pendling back, so sitting on the sitting backwards. Whoa.

That's insane. Yeah. Oh, my God. So, okay, raise money for for some some kind of foundation or something. Rubin.

Rubin, what else be? Shout out, Rubin. Yeah.

“And if you, if you want to enter this competition, make sure you go to ventom.com.”

Sorry, ventomracin.com/themove. And while you're there, use code the move 10 for 10% off. Anything on the site, including any bike. So, don't miss out on on that chance. And Johan, is there anything else you want to talk about before we take off?

No, I think we covered everything. Congrats. All right. All right. Yeah.

And hopefully, we can see a few other developments now, which we will. I mean, the stages will be different from that one. Yeah, everybody's going to be, you know, licking their wounds still the next big appointment. When the race is going to enter a weird phase, you know,

it's, there's no mountain stages until stage 14. And it's going to be a lot of sprint transition breakable days. I would imagine. It's not going to be easy on you a year. No.

No, not at all. This is, this is the price.

“You have to pay for such a domination of, you know, such a domination.”

That's that everything is for you. And they're going to get through, you know, some stages in the central homocyph that are very, very hard. Although it's not a mountain state, but it's very hard. Sometimes, some of those stages are harder than a real mountain stage.

Yeah. When you talk about the race being potentially out of control today,

it gets never really out of control.

If there's the aspect in the tourmalade, because no. You just act the option of going hard on those. But they aren't there. They can't get out of control. Mm-hmm.

Okay. Our next answer. Thanks, Johan. And we will talk tomorrow.