Peter Hamby: How Far Can the DSA Go?

Hello and welcome to the Bullard Podcast.

I'm your host Tim Miller. I'd like to come back to the show.

“My buddy, USA soccer, super fan, football, super fan.”

He's the former host of Good Luck America on Snapchat. He just announced I'm Monday that he's joining Puck full time as Chief National correspondent. He's also been the host of the Powers that be podcast. It's Peter Handby. What's up, bro?

Hey man, how you doing? I'm doing well. I'm on the meant. So I've got my gator light here, rapid rehydration, and we're doing pretty good. Better than yesterday's podcast.

We're going to really nerd out as is our want on campaign politics. Sure.

A lot of results last night that are interesting.

The takes are flying. A little before we get to kind of going around the map. I just want to pick out a couple of things from The Maggie Hayverman Jonathan Swan book. Probably go deep on this next week, but some of the excerpts are leaking out there.

I guess we should start with the J.D. Marko stuff. They have this anecdote in the book about how Trump's re-directed the office. Famously put a lot of gold flourishes in there. Many listeners are unhappy with my take about how. I think the more is more affect is a little bit better than what Biden had in the overall office.

People don't like it. That's my least part of our take, but I'm standing by it. Anyway, I haven't heard this take from you, sorry.

“You think you should do sort of maximalist decorations in the overall office.”

I like the maximalist decorations. When you see the images of Biden, you see the side by side. Biden's pallid skin with like the gray off white walls. It's just not good. I feel like it's millennials.

One of our big misses is everybody. We tried to minimize everything. Everything was being streamlined. Everybody's houses were more clean. A lot more whites and off whites. It's like the cracker barrel redesign.

I hated the cracker barrel redesign. It's like that coffee shop we went to and slow those years ago. There's like, and by the way, I'm guilty. You can see behind me having like hanging Ivy. But, you know, the, yeah, exactly the beige countertops and the sort of sign where you put in the like,

like a little letters to order the flat white or whatever and they're playing, like a low, tame, and pola beads for the idea. I don't, by the way, Biden definitely was doing that. But I do think though the colors kind of work actually, maybe even the lighting things do feel a little brighter in there when you see the camera pool.

They feel brighter. I mean, I wouldn't do like everything like Home Depot goal. But I just think as a general matter, a little more maximalism is good. Anyway, Trump at was asked about whether he's worried that his successor will undo all that he had done, design-wise.

I mean, that's probably as a real worry for Trump. And he, his response was the Cubans love gold, which is a little slight Trump response. He likes to do this. He has to play these guys off each other.

And, you know, he's got, he's got JD, you know, eating shit right now on, on the Iran deal. I don't really buy it that Marco is passable for the Republican electorate, but I don't know. I'm just curious what you make of all of it. So I talked about this the other day, which we'll be off on my podcast. Thanks for the shot.

I'll run YouTube now. The powers that be-- If you go into polling, and I did this the other day with some of our echelon polling, they basically test every question in their battery among Maga Republicans and party first Republicans. Now, you, Tim, and maybe some Bullwerke listeners would have once identified as a party first Republican,

like the more, you know, traditional Bush McCain Reagan types before Donald Trump came along. It's been a minute. It's been a minute. But they're still out there to an extent. And they tested, and I just actually looked in the cross tabs,

those are horse race numbers for Republicans, 2021. And Marco loses to vans among party first Republicans, but not by that much. And he's been creeping up in polls.

“I can't remember that I was talking ahead,”

but say he was losing to JD by like 13 points in that horse race poll. Pretty good place to be.

Like, I always think heading into presidential primaries.

You'd rather run from behind than be the front runner at the whole time. But JD is crushing Marco among Maga Republicans. Those Trump first Republicans, like 30 or 40 points. And like, look, that's the party. And the primary thought that was what it was.

Exactly. And look, I think JD is definitely out there eating shit in the sense that, you know, no one in the foreign policy blob thinks this memorandum of understanding is anything more than a junior high school level, like document in terms of diplomacy.

It's unpopular, the war is unpopular. And JD is also Hawking his book right now, which means he's like has this previously booked media tour. So he's out there.

honestly, he likes the JD will go out there and eat shit.

And you know, this also comes up in Maggie and Jonathan's book. But Trump can't really talk anymore. Like he's got like a madlips bucket of like 40 words that he grabs into. And he's like, it could be any question. It could be a question about Ukraine.

It'll reach in and be like auto pen, you know? Like whatever is wrong. Whatever it is. Yeah.

“And, you know, look, I think that if JD is eating shit with the press and the foreign policy establishment,”

Republicans on Capitol Hill, especially Republican senators, and the media and voter out there independent voter who doesn't like Trump, doesn't like JD man, doesn't like the war. But the whole ball game is really the Republican primary at this point, if they're looking around the band.

And, you know, maybe this is a cynical political perspective to have for JD events, but if you're him, you know, I think you'd rather just completely own being a Trump oil soldier than try to do this dance where you're like half in and half out.

And completely own the America first thing, which is like, I mean,

even though it's an embarrassing MLU and the total surrender and it's humiliating, it does put him in the position of being like, I wanted us out of this, as opposed to being the one that wanted us in. So I think that out. It's the only fun wrinkle in it is, who knows what the fuck 82 year old dementia,

what a little Trump is going to want to do in two years. And we'll talk about his aging next, but so we'll try to do some crazy, obviously, what exactly that will look like who knows. But assuming he moves on to retired life at Marlaga, or in the ADU bunker underneath the White House,

like he will not do what Bush did. Like it's not like he's going to go away and paint. Right. Like he is going to like tweet and play ball. Yeah.

And so could he drag Marco across the line of JD pissed him off, like sure.

“And my reaction to that at first was like, do Cubans like gold?”

Like where did that come from? I mean Cubans like baseball and coffee and Cubans are very patriotic. The Cuban Americans, I just actually googled this. Um, figures. AI is so dumb and wrong sometimes.

They just make things up because they're scraping like a reddit thread. But this is this is Gemini. I ask do Cubans love gold. Yes, Cubans generally have a strong cultural affinity for gold. In Cuban culture, bold gold jewelry.

Most notably the iconic interlocking Miami Cuban link chain chain necklace is deeply valued as a symbol of success, prosperity and resilience. So if we see Marco in a pit bull style. Cubans. Look, I have to go chain.

That's funny. But you mentioned the Trump can't talk anymore. This is a couple other things from the book. He is also having trouble hearing asking people to repeat questions. They just asked.

Hey, run in Swan Road. They started to have press conferences with world leaders in the Oval Office. Because the acoustics were better. Then in the bigger eastern where they had been holding those meetings. I find this hard to believe, but I guess these people would know.

The people around Trump say that the thin verbal filter that he had in the past was gone. Stuff that he used to only say in private, he was now saying publicly. I like to this one. Trump was upset about the coverage of his cancels. We did extensive cancels coverage here on the bull were YouTube feeds.

So I'm happy to hear that bother to him. And he asked the press secretary to address it during a media briefing. Some of you saw that was an odd topic. But it was in keeping with his obsession with his declining appearance. And like this stuff we see publicly.

“But I think that like it's pretty notable over the last year that he's”

visibly declined. And I think that there's a lot of frustration during the campaign. It was like, why isn't Trump's age as much of a deal as Biden's? And like it was a fair fine point to make as an academic exercise. But like he just didn't seem like he was declining as much as Biden.

Just in like the physical characteristics. And that is happening to him now. There's also the makeup on his hands thing. I think that Maggie and Jonathan report on. And now, the neck, the hair in the light house.

If you have access to the best physicians in the country. And it's very clear. He cares about his appearance given his hair and orangeness. But he has to show his hands on camera and briefings or whatever. And people, you know, eagle eye people on Twitter like zoom in on his hands.

You think they have like better. Kind of concealer like it's like mismatched. Make up. And so in other words. But instead of getting the press taken to go out there and like talk about the cancels,

which by the way, didn't they say something like, didn't care. Carolina and Levitt talk about his Venus. Insufficiency at one point from the podium. I believe that's the cause of the swelling.

Yeah. So clearly like they did. I also thought you were going to bring up. And this wasn't in the book, but stat news reported this the other day.

The fact that this is that that was incredible.

Yeah. That I forget which was either the government or or the pharmaceutical company. And they cleared a single use dosage of reddit true tied,

I'm sure RFK junior uses it.

It's like a GLP one, but it also makes you jacked. Like a, you know, I live in LA. I know people who do like peptides and like get shredded off. I didn't bring it up because I was deferring to your expertise on this. Thank you.

Yes. Yeah. The scene was very clearly shredded. The White House wouldn't address it. So it's like a non-denial denial.

It's not approved for for anyone at that age using it. And federal health officials got involved. It was a great scoop. There's just very obviously clear that the White House got this for a 70. That says a 79 year old man earlier this year in April.

He's not 80. And I just wanted your take on this actually because he looks kind of the same weight. Like if he is on a GLP one, he certainly like slimmer. Like remember during the playoffs when the White House was posting like

him, it's quite cited in X game from like the 90s, not that he could name

or pick a mark, a spot of minor out of a line up. But they were like talking about how much of it makes for anyone. He looked like like a Chobo in the 90s. Like he had like a puffy face and stuff. Right.

He does look like slimmer than back then. Yeah. But even compared to a few months ago, if he is taking a GLP one, he doesn't look skinnier. Yeah.

Now he looks still hefty to me. Yeah.

“I think he still would be wearing the man's ear.”

You know, there was also the other swan. Haberman anecdote was like, his room is bad. I don't like to really think about his bedroom. But his bedroom in the White House is apparently disgusting. Like there are like candy wrappers everywhere.

And like I guess he like binge gorges at night at the end. And like least disgusting food wrappers everywhere and stuff. So I just like that you switch. You came out with binges, which I think would be the proper. Health term. I just switched it to gorges.

Hasn't happened. And so again, instead of you know, if you're having the rare fat shot, you know, that it's only available, you know, on a compassionate thing. But he kind of teases other people about the fat shot.

Yeah. Trump our ex dot gov initiative includes like like you can buy direct from the pharmaceutical companies. A variety of drugs at which he says is an negotiated discount. And he talked about the fat shot a lot when they launched us a few months ago. And he would poke fun at people like donors.

He's like, I know a heavy set guy like a fat guy. Yeah. And we'll say who he is. But he takes the fat shot. Like he makes on other people.

Yeah. But it seems pretty clear. He has taken the fat shot.

“I think that it's very possible that the president of the States is taking an experimental fat shot.”

But I don't know that we fully know for sure. Could be another 79 year old welcome acted fatty. Could be. But didn't they accelerate? Didn't.

I don't know. Couldn't. Didn't they accelerate during COVID? Like remember when he got COVID? Like didn't they accelerate?

He did take some experimental COVID medicine. Experiments. That they have access to it. And I would too. I would too.

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Okay. Moving on to the primary last night in New York. Just a total route for the DSA challenges in New York. The mom Donnie Slate. One basically everything they'd add.

“You might remember from during the NBA finals.”

Like they're passing the basketball to each other. It's Brablander. It's Daria Lisa Shavaliye. It's Valdez. These three DSA challenges to democratic congressmen.

All of them won. Handily. Well, I guess DSA's race was kind of close. You know, that is causing some consternation among the New York establishment. Tish James was offering this morning.

She's a little bit concerned about this. You sent me some good analysis from the Yimbee land account on social media,

And he kind of, I think, summed up the level of concern about these types of lefty challengers, thusly. Mom Donnie seems like a cool dude who really knows how to vibe with all kinds of folks.

The second wave of DSA people don't have the same vibe.

They're going to say a bunch of shit that scares the host and wind up hurting progressives. This will open up a huge lane for ours in 2028. I'm not sure if it's going to open up a huge price of 2028. But a lot here. Let's just kind of talk about first about like the winning DSA challengers.

“Yeah, look, I think you're absolutely right.”

It's giving Democrats mainstream Democrats a lot of heartburn. Someone texted me last night. The good thing about the mom Donnist purges when they come is that they don't believe in prisons. And look, I mean, I want to get into some details of these races.

And I think it's also fair to look at this as a limited New York slash mom Donnie phenomenon. Because we've talked about this. I mean, mom Donnie, despite saying he has his music taste is pretty limited. When he came on the board podcast, when he was running for mayor,

is a people throw this word around, like generational talent.

But he is. He just is. He just is. He's got it. If you, like you said the other day, like if he wasn't born in Africa,

like would be talking about him running for president. And like this is one thing. It's that this time. 28. Yeah, exactly.

He's magnetic. He's good at social media. All of this sort of tactical, superficial stuff. Yes.

“But remember, yeah, he ran as a socialist.”

And a free Palestine candidate.

And that's spooked a lot of mainstream Democrats and Jews, of course. And like, a package in. And, you know, this is the reason Dan Goldman lost in the city. Like the free Palestine movement has replaced the COVID safety movement. And which replaced the, you know, pro climates sunrise movement.

Like there's a through line of like young people in cities there. But he also is governing as a, like, you know, a pot hole guy. He was out there shoveling the snow in the homeless inside the gaze. Love wearing the 12,000 holes filled shirt. Yeah.

You know, instead of like during his campaign, even he acknowledged he did the defund the police thing. And then broke bread with the cops and hasn't talked shit about cops. Increased increased police funding. That's happening again. And also out here in LA with Nithiram and who is DSA affiliated, not full DSA, who was a defund person,

who is now running away from that and Karen Bass is vlogging her with that. But back to New York, you know, he's governing not as a socialist ideologue. And on top of the fact that he's got mega ris. And his young and his speech about the nicks at the before the next victory parade. I was talking to people out here in my friend group who like aren't DSA.

So these people at least weren't DSA fans or Zora fans. Like that's one of the best speeches I've ever seen. Like he just makes politics relatable and tangible to people in a way that doesn't feel academic. Now, these other candidates, you won last night. And there are also a bunch of people that went to the state assembly.

These are not as charismatic candidates.

“And in the case of Chivalier, I think that tweet from Yimbilan is correct,”

which is that, you know, she, by the way, when reason I'm wearing this jersey, she said she was rooting against the world US and the World Cup. Let me run through her greatest tips. Can we just do that? Sure, because, like, I just in these other candidates, Valdez seems like, I mean, she's left. But like kind of a conventional Bernie style.

Yeah, but also like labor labor left. Yeah. Lander, we talked about the golden and deal yesterday. Like, Lander has played this very well. And like one thing, this funny, the one, you mentioned that when Zoran came on my pod,

that the question that I, the cause, the controversy about asking about, like, whether, you know, he can, can dams, like, globalize it into Fata. One of the reasons why I was like, that was totally fair question. And he shouldn't have bungled it was that they had asked the same question at the debate a week before.

And Lander gave this great, like, nuanced answer to it. As somebody who's like, a Jew and wants his, as you say, he from, like, he wouldn't say it for that reason. But he's also upset about the way that Israel's acting now. Like, Lander just hit, like, definitely navigated the situation.

The, the kind of changing views on, on Israel's behavior. And yeah, he would be not even in a primary. He was a extremely strong candidate. I don't know. Should we call her Daria Lisa Chavallier, or DAC?

I kind of like, DAC is an AOC. I think DAC is an AOC. I think DAC is an AOC. Okay. We're going to call DAC.

I want to read you some of her hits. She attended a pro-Palestinian rally in Times Square on October 8th, 2023. So the day after the October 7th terrorist attack, Brad Lander left the DSA over their promotion of that same rally.

She had thousands of posts in repost expressing support for abolishing police presence

She rejected, you know, how some of the lefties try to spin the, like,

abolish the police was more of just like, this is kind of more of a saying. It didn't mean, like, literally defund the police. It was just a budget procedure. Yeah.

Yeah. It was kind of more of a, it was like, more of a bumper sticker thing. It was, no, she rejected that and says, no, it means ending policing full stop period. No more police at all ever.

Clap emoji, clap emoji, clap emoji, clap emoji, clap emoji. So, um, those are you on that. She was then asked about this in this campaign on this New York editorial board thing that Ben Smith is doing. She was asked four times about what to do about murderers,

and whether they should go to jail. And she couldn't answer that question. She posted fuck Kamala Harris. She called Joe Biden a rapist. She said that all deportation is wrong.

And as you mentioned, she said she was reading for Senegal in the World Cup.

I googled this as running. She's not appear to be Senegalese. So I don't know why. She has some Dominican and Venezuelan origin. Maybe also some Senegal.

I don't know. But she said she was reading for Senegal in the World Cup. And she also said that when she couldn't find a napkin. She wiped her dirty hands on the American flag. So that's what you're saying.

She's a bulwark candidate. I don't know, man. I mean, I'm open to creative ideas for ways that the Democrats are trying to do things differently. But that's, I'm not vibing on that.

She called white women ugly colonizer women. Sort of.

“Also, Senegal is a generational marriage at one point, I think.”

Yeah, look. I mean, I think this is what I'm getting at. And Bernie to his credit over the years. Really has focused on economic populism. Yes, class warfare, sure.

You know, taxing the rich billionaires. He's very uncomfortable with cultural issues.

He never, you know, he was more aligned.

You know, in the early Trump days and pre-Trump days with, you know, labor unions, he's still sorry. But like back in the 2019 primaries, 2020, when the Democrats were all raising their hand to like decriminalized border crossings.

Like that's not Bernie. Bernie, like, you know, he's from the rural state. Like he, you know, isn't like a gun. Anti gun or crusader or gun safety person. These are cultural issues.

This aren't his back. He cares about economic issues. And that's, that all of a sudden apart from AOC, who did have prison abolition tweets. And does, and has at least talked about intersectionality

and pronouns in her bio, you know, whatever, however many genders, James Toleriko thinks there are.

“And so that's, I think, what I'm getting out with Momsdani”

is for all of his, yes, he's when he's asked about his real life. When he's asked about Israel, APEC, and Palestine, he talks about it with reporters. But front of mine for him, messaging is like, constituent services and like affordability.

And those things that despite his, his DSA branding and history, he's governing as just a mayor. And like Chivalier, you know, she's going to get to Congress. And it's, by the way, Valdez is also,

like, don't send any money to Israel, not even Iron Dough. Okay, but again, I think she's more rigorously on message. I mean, that's going to be the majority position on the Democratic. Yes. But, you know, I can see Chivalier getting to Congress

and being like a louder, more lightning rod version of, you know, Rashida Slay. Like she seems like, she's a poster. She can't help herself. She is one of these like extremely online,

you know, millennial jensee Cospers, who has made social justice their entire personality. And a lot of Saviour politicians, I think, and who's to say if she's Saviour and not because she won. But she's going to go to Washington after having won a D+30 district.

And, you know, a lot of New Yorkers are like this, whether they're in politics or not. They think New York's a center of the universe. And that she has a mandate to, you know, talk about Palestine and Israel.

And it's going to be a, it's going to be a thorn in the side of Democratic leadership. I'm certain. She, I mean, she beat the chair of this band of caucus, so we got to, at least recognize that.

And he ran a horrific campaign. The New York Times did break out, which precincts these candidates won in and lost in. And the DSA phenomenon, while they did make in Rhodes last night with black and,

and Hispanics, it continues to be a white affluent phenomenon. One Democrat, like close to Jeffries told me yesterday, that the district that Clearvel does, a one in, which is a New York seven called the most gentrified district

in the country.

“Like, this is the MJ Lenderman, like Bushwick voter, right?”

Like the white, like Columbia Protester, like, Chivaly A. Just on that sort, there's this great video that I said of the her event, where it's like, you're next.

They're all shouting, you're next. You're next. You're next at Hucking Jeffries, which shows you that this is going to be a thorn in the side of the establishment. And at some level of Hucking Jeffries can,

can probably use some challenging. Yeah, no, it is all dirt bag white people

I just like your classic stereotype Brooklyn look, you know, kind of shouting at Hucking Jeffries at this event. So.

“Yeah, and I think looking at the broader picture from last night,”

while New York thinks the center of the universe, Mondani himself has political capital and spent it to get his people elected. Now, again, outside of New York, the DSA's success story is not the same.

It's just not.

Let's just pause that for a second.

We're going to go around the world. Sure. I said a couple of New York things this one ahead on. The sun of this make your point. So you've richy Torres, who is just been kind of the most pro,

as real Democrat, really, even more so than Dan Goldman, interestingly, he won last night. He didn't have a strong DSA challenge, or he did have a challenger kind of pretended to be DSA kind of,

but he's in a more working class district. He's not in the Bronx. It's not not as many, you know, college educated teachers. Not as many white renters.

So that's notable. In New York 12, which is the district that George Conway ran in, RIP, George Conway. I just thought there would be better districts for him than that, but nothing but love for George.

Michael Asher, when Zach Canada, who's the establishment candidate, replacing Jerry Navlar, Jerry Navlar, and George.

You're going to expect, like, five million, like,

bunch of millions on him. Yeah. He wins that in New York 12. And then AOC, interestingly, has no tweets at the time we're recording this

about any of these candidates. I don't know exactly what the plan is for AOC, but she's been very savvy, I think, lately on picking fights, picking battles, or maybe it turns out to be not savvy.

I don't know who knows, but she is definitely not going all in with this, like, kind of DSA crowd to the same degree that you might thought she would. Yeah, she's been over the years. Like, again, she had the prison abolition tweets

and the intersectionality tweets. But the lefty cultural stuff, you know, transgender surgeries for prisoners. She has moved away from that. This is her backyard.

She is supposedly deeply involved, and I think she has deeply involved. She was at the next parade. She was at Mount Donny, but she, like, whether she wants to run statewide.

And by the way, we're talking about the socialist, Kathy Hockel, like, has run a great campaign and clashed a potential challenger from the left who dropped out of the race many months ago. Or whether AOC wants to run for prison,

I think she understands that the, you know, civilian, wipe your ass with the American flag thing. That's not going to play in Pennsylvania or North Carolina. She is still on popular with the median voter, like, AOC. Like, Democrats and the press are obsessed with AOC.

She has work to do with independent voters if she wants to have a larger national profile. But also look at Bernie Sanders. He endorsed Clair Valdez, he endorsed Bradlander. He did not endorse Chivalet.

Well, I'm Donny, didn't do it. He did it, Row, I know. Yeah. He's been endorsing out of those candidates, also didn't. Exactly.

And maybe that's because, like, he personally, or his team did a vet and they're, like, she doesn't seem like she's going to keep her eye on the ball, which is, you know, we got to focus on the billionaire class. She's going to be a distraction.

And even last night, Bernie, he congratulated after they won. And not congratulate Chivalet. And so I think if you are interested in building political power as a leftist in this country,

“you have to focus on affordability, access to housing and health care,”

and try to mitigate as much as possible. The social issues that are going to drag you down. I was talking to someone at the NRCC, the National Public and Campaign Community last night. Who was just like, oh, my gosh, when they call this race, they go scorched Earth. Like, remember in 2018 or 2020,

and all the house ads, they would shove Pelosi's face in that. So Republicans, and then AOC. And Elon, no more space would be in there. But like, Chivalet is going to be that person now for Republican ad makers, and who knows if that matters or not.

And like, you know, frontline districts in Nebraska. But Republicans will certainly try to make this person the face of an America-hating socialist, abolished prisons, you know, democratic party. But the only thing I'd add to that on AOC is in addition to kind of like the not engaging in some of the potentially more brand harmful,

you know, fights that you're seeing in the activist circles. She is picking other fights, and she's been here in the deep south, rallying against the data center. The data center video she did was really good. Yeah, so she's been in there on the voting right stuff on data center stuff.

You know, her little press conference coming out of the house. She's doing during a lot of the shutdown fights. So it's definitely not worth it. That she didn't fully wrap herself in this kind of non-dione movement. There's some pretty significant GOP fuckups.

Is this love that I'm doing this from?

There's like always this kind of sense that like,

Democrats are the responsible party and you're expecting to be responsible, and like the Republicans are the children, and you don't expect them to.

“And so I think Democrats do irresponsible things.”

You really focus on it.

but just really quick for you to that.

A quick around the country last night. So DSA candidates lost in primaries in Maryland in Utah, less more. And this against speaks to having a charismatic endorsy matters. Like a lot of voters just don't, aren't as nerdy as we are. Like in minute 33 of a podcast where they know the details of every candidate.

They're like, I like Zoron. He said these are the people he like. I'm going with it. Westmore did this in Maryland. They go, he's popular in Maryland.

Different type of Democrat, obviously. A lot of the Democrats have apparently hit the ones he endorsed last night. When I'm Maryland, he, one of his endorsy's wins over a, of a Pelosi pick in the Maryland fifth district. He went some of the local races. Then you got to Utah, then McAdams is a more moderate candidate.

He wins over a buzzy left candidate, Nate blue and in the Salt Lake district.

“I think the Democrats are going to pick up strong, dim kind of reformists.”

Center left candidate in South Carolina 1 Charleston. That was that seat that, that the Democrats did take the last wave year. Well, that would have been 18 and then mace the mace takes the seed after that. Joe Cunningham, yeah. Yeah, Joe Cunningham.

Yeah, there's been some redistricting sense of something exactly the same seat. But anyway, that's kind of what else was happening around the country outside of New York. You're trying to know if you have anything else on that. Yeah, no. I mean, Westmore, you know, I think with Bill himself is a results oriented pragmatic democrat.

His pick in Maryland's fifth feedback, DSA Challenger. By the way, also in New York, I mentioned Hockel in the 17th district, which is Mike Lawler. Kate Conley, one handily. That's like Upper Westchester Hudson Valley. There was a, you know, free Palestine justice person in that race who she actually absolutely curb stomped.

You've got Utah. You've got county executive seats in Maryland that DSA people lost in. And this is a larger thing I wanted to talk to you about is the limitations.

“The question is, is this a limited phenomenon to New York City?”

These dense urban strongholds with a lot of affluent college educated surplice elites, quite frankly, who see politics as a hobby. And obviously have issues that they're passionate about, but does it extend beyond New York? Because here in LA, you've got DSA members on the city council who got re-elected pretty handling the primary or will win in November. You've got, if you're ramen, who again is not pure bread DSA, but had some DSA support in the past. And you do have in Seattle, you know, a socialist affiliated mayor, you're aware about to have that and watched in DC.

And so in the blue urban cores, you do see it. But like, there's not really like a vibrant DSA in Boston. There's not certainly not in San Francisco right now. Daniel Larry has swept most of them to the curb. And then you go bigger than just the cities where, you know, oh, sorry, we have a DSA mayor in Chicago who is a flop, that's for sure.

You know, you've got Abdul Oslaid and Michigan, if he wins, that would be the first real kind of statewide, I think.

DSA success story, DSA affiliated, I think. Yeah, depends on what kind of pattern. Yeah, but look at California, like California 22 is a great example. So up and up in the valley, right, there's, this is David Valdez district. Randy Villegas is a Bernie endorsed candidate, a young Latino guy who advanced to the general election.

Be back, you know, the Jeffrey's D trip person. And, you know, he's running on, yes, he mentioned the APAC, he mentioned the APAC sometimes. But that district has more people in Medicaid than any district in the country. Like if he's going door to door and talking about Palestine, you know, he gets waxed, but he's talking about affordability and health care.

And yes, Bernie endorsed him, but that gets to Bernie's antenna. Like, this guy is running on working class middle class issues.

“And so I think a real test will be like, that's a frontline battleground district with a Bernie endorsed candidate who is not in a blue urban core.”

And so California 22 will be like a great test case. And also in California, lots of other socialist wannabes ran and lost all over the state. And yes, it's expensive out here, but so is New York.

And so yeah, I mean, I think the candidate charisma thing can't be under counted as a big factor in this race that nomadani ad you mentioned during the next playoff series was incredible.

You had people looking for signal from him millions of people in New York almost everybody tuned into the next playoff games. Here's an ad and Zaron Lundani who most people like, although less popular than they know Larry, I should say, one of my Larry friends told me to say that. He's on camera saying vote for Svalli, vote for Valdas, vote for Leonard. Okay, like that's a validator for me. Good. Like, and like that's his risk. Like, it's not necessarily just win because of DSA or because of justice, dams or because of, you know, working families party.

I mean, I think we can be honest. I think that the, and I want to get into some counter executives.

And oh, yeah. And obviously on Israel.

And that's something to do with left.

“Yeah, sure. So that's something. I think that like, there are a couple of different things happening.”

That's all. It's a big diverse country. Things are having different districts or a couple of different things that are happening all the same time. It's like, there's like a brand of like social justice left person who like you said would have been an occupied Wall Street person 20 years ago would have been a climate person 10 years ago would have been, you know, COVID masking forever masking five years ago and it's like now this.

And that's like an Omni cause kind of left activist person.

That is what is organising the big cities and that is a lot of college educated affluent whites and, you know, but their in coalition, I think, you know, with a lot of minority voters and there having success in urban areas like for sure. DAC is like not going to win a primary anywhere else. And that's not like a 2028 path to success, right? Like there's just that there's just isn't majority support for that. The question then is more of, okay, like, what is the right path elsewhere and like what is the right, you know, what are the things that can be taken from the populist left or what types of candidates can we, you know, and that's really looking at a Dan Osborne type.

Look at maybe else I eat will see platner and different things is like, can you run where it is more like a Bernie 16 style thing that focuses on economic and the foreign policy side and the emphasizes the cultural stuff.

“We're about to find out in November, but like I think that is I think that argument is what's winning, but they might be right.”

But part of the reason I think they're winning the argument is that there's a lot of frustration among Democrats, like we tried it the establishment's way we put up Kamala Joe Biden.

Hillary Trump one twice Trump one twice, like people like I saw this conversation in the internet like why weren't people happier with Dan Goldman and why aren't they happier with the day and again, I'm a Colorado, she's running ads with what about impeachment. And it's like, well, yeah, I'm students from day while. It's like, damn, kind of voters aren't impressed with your work and impeachment because Trump fucking won again, you know, they're kind of voters like we're looking for something different is this thing that is being offered the right thing. I don't know, I wouldn't put my mortgage on it, but I think that it's totally explicable why they're looking for that different thing, given Trump's two-time win.

What I agree with you on is that you can take the economic populism, whatever the argument, like the power utilities are driving up rates for you or, you know, you can't afford the rent, export those anywhere in the country. I agree with you on that. The social justice cultural stuff, I think, like you said, no one agrees that that can be exported. I think the common takeaway also is the generational aspect and the fact that I think democratic leadership in Washington and the older generation just doesn't understand the anger of the base right now.

And this happened with Crowley and AOC in 2018 and the issue set was a little different and it was a different era and I was the first Trump term, but this just restive democratic base that says, you guys, not only aren't doing enough, but you have failed. And I think this is what we're seeing from this up and coming generation who's screaming that these ossified leaders haven't done anything for you, that's valuable for sure. And I think that is a signal lesson that we've been seeing across primary elections everywhere, like that's absolutely the case.

But let's look at some of the Republican fails. We're going to wrap it fire. So I don't think it's talking about the Georgia. I don't know if somebody people are but are you saying the media is too focused on New York and doesn't understand red and purple states or lead their cultural and academic and elite bubbles. Maybe Peter or maybe these races are just kind of boring and so there's not as much to talk about, but so I will try to make a dramatic statement right now about the races in Georgia North Carolina that, you know, will hopefully drive attention to races that are boring.

“I think that the Republicans are going to stop spending money in either Georgia or North Carolina or both, but the end of the year. I think we're going to give up on both of those races in the Senate.”

Here are the last five polls in the North Carolina Senate race, Roy Cooper plus 14 plus 11 plus 7 plus 9 plus 8, like that feels non real, Trump one North Carolina in Georgia. Here's the money disparity. I don't know how that's going to play in Atlanta, but I think quite.

Especially the Republican nominee in North Carolina is just a great example of the downsides of this late stage. Trumpism where he just won the primary because he's a Trump functionary and is a lifeless political talent, you know, despite being a former RNC chairman is also not doing a great job raising money.

“The Georgia race also that interests me is the governor's race because, and this is also kind of a symptom of Trumpism, you have this, I think is a card dealer, the Rick Jackson guy. I think health care executive health care.”

That's right. That's right. That's right. Then you have this rascally outsider spending all of his money promising outlandish things and he wins the primary despite Trump endorsing Bert Jones and I've been saying this recently a lot. If you look at Iowa look at Ohio and also Georgia, this is another strength for Georgia, you've got this tandem going on on the Democratic ticket. That's a very strong, well-funded Senate candidate in John Ossoff and, you know, Kieshelansbottom is perhaps not as popular but safe sort of governor choice who will play well in Atlanta and maybe some of the Atlanta suburbs and, you know, possibly upon pockets of rural black folks in that state balancing each other out like all soft will need to get some black voters out and lands bottoms will help him and I just think that that compared to the Republican dysfunction.

You can just kind of read the writing on the wall and certain races and midterm years like the environment is so bad, there's Canada talent, there's money like fundamentals still count for something and I'm with Georgia. If you got, if I'm a national Republican and I'm looking at the map and like shit, we could put 10 million dollars on air in Georgia this week in October or we could do that in Ohio or we could do that in Alaska shit even Texas.

You're trying to steal Michigan maybe if you're trying to go on offense, take a shot, I don't think that's probably unlikely but it feels more likely.

The Republican Senate committee is just rake stepping all over the south and that's enjoyable. You mentioned in addition to Trump losing, Trump is losing his touch on the governor's race in Dorsese. You mentioned he lost the Georgia governor's race in Dorsese in Iowa, he endorsed Randy Fiendstrom over the cockering mag night and then last night his South Carolina endorsement choice lost. You've got absolutely fucking wax kind of say that we're good on the bullworks, sorry listeners.

This was fascinating and didn't get enough coverage and also kind of shows how like.

I don't know, washes and reporters kind of miss the force that she's sometimes the South Carolina governor's race. There's as a crowded field. The lieutenant governor, Pam Evett, the lieutenant governor of the Henryk master was one of Trump's earliest endorsers, you know, his team lobbied the Trump political team at the White House for an endorsement because the Trump endorsement always wins primarys. Trump gave this perfunctory half-hearted true social endorsement which he's want to do in his cancels era and you know his heart wasn't in it.

So there to barren storm the state he's busy, there's a war in Iran, I get it.

“But Evett, like just totally flop sheet, she won the primary barely, I think, but didn't even hit 30 percent.”

I know it was a crowded primary.

I can't think of any Republican primary team in the entire Trump era where one of his endorsed candidates only got 30 percent.

And so I wrote for Puck, like, well, this is bad news, this is a huge flop. People like someone from roll call was like Trump's candidates won, go to the runoff, Allen Wilson, the attorney general. He won by like 30 points all over the state. He won every county. He won Greenville County. And like some of that is candidate talent, like they didn't scrutinize this person when you're a lieutenant governor, like you don't do anything. She's the opposite of mom Donnie, like zero is and, you know, Trump's guv candidates, like he's lost three endorsements.

And I'm not saying the magic is worn off because when they put their sweat and money into beating people they don't like. And Indiana in Kentucky with Thomas Massey, the Trump people pull it off.

“But when they just sort of like fire off this half-hearted endorsement on true social, like, you know, I think some voters like want a little more than that.”

I'm surprised that Nancy Macy's attack on Allen Wilson that he protected sexual abusers and he dismissed child porn cases. I'm surprised that didn't land. I don't know if that's because South Carolina voters are like pro Epstein now or because they think that Nancy Macy's crazy. I mean, having lived in Columbia, like, there's just a lot of personal authorities there for things that we can't even think about.

Like there's probably some, they probably like are miffed at each other that someone didn't like buy him a drink in five points and like two thousand and seven and like that manifests itself to that.

“Somebody slap somebody else's staff are not Tim Scott because we got a respect based actuals.”

It's a part of its pride, my third part of the LGBTQI plus community, but it's so one of the other to my death.

Speaking of pride, might any other any additional thoughts on the Iowa conquering vibrating conquering magnet, the Republicans have nominated. We spent a lot of time and I will firm tech is a sexual health company. And I just, I haven't had a chance to to get my in charge yet. We appreciated the gift that the firm tech people sent me and, you know, we'll see, we'll give a review at some point. Allen, I would like your your review on camera, please. Thanks. I don't know. Don't seem like a great nominee.

I think it's still running a pace for Rob's in there in the Iowa governor's race. All right, are we going to get to dessert? Oh wait, before dessert? No, I promised you if we're going to have you back on. You were smeared. Your reputation was smeared on the board five times. I guess it's out of smear.

A smear would be saying something about someone that is untrue.

You were attacked. No, I was attacked on the board five times by my in John Fabrow. In love, it was a loving attack because, you know, your takes, we're all out here sling and takes all the time. And so we have some messes. We'll get into one of mine, but you were a little bit a little bit more bullish on Spencer Pratt than maybe it married it.

“That's what my point was a little more bullish.”

Let me revisit. I had not even have to do this. A deeply reported article examining whether Spencer Pratt can win in Los Angeles, both as an influencer candidate. And as a, you know, crime and public safety Republican and expand his appeal beyond just white people in Los Angeles. That was the premise of it. What's out the answer was extremely no. No, not even close.

Which I was one of the few people journalists who wrote that he has no appeal with black and Latino voters. If anyone read below it. Anyway, I felt smeared because you lumped a factual statement, which is that Spencer Pratt went around Los Angeles.

And he never mentioned Donald Trump and talked about Daniel Lurry as his role model.

That was Phony or not. You had that idea of like a bunch of like right-wing Tommy Laryn Clay Travis takes about how Spencer Pratt was going to save L.A. And then you were like, and here's Peter Hamby and you're both like laughing at his friend. I thought that was silly. And then John, you know, also bud, but like, I'm sorry, guys. There was one poll showing nithiroms. So make sure this is fine.

You're a little thought that nithiroms was going to make the runoff except for like a handful of people in Silver Lake. Everyone thought Spencer Pratt was going to make the runoff. But those same people no one thought he was actually going to win the election. And so I just thought as to act to this a miss. That's a fun of journalists just writing an article.

I didn't miss that. Those are miss. Those are miss. And because of that, I wanted to give you the opportunity to fire back on any bad takes. You've taken me out of that. I'm not going to concede that was not a miss. Those are miss. But fabs and I also miss. And so I just wondered if giving you an open, open swing.

We'll do fabs than you. So John and his team campaigned very hard for Karen Bass and 2022 on their content activations. Con Rick Caruso, a board billionaire who can't do the job of running LA. Again, a lot of people here probably regret that. You know, that was like pre, that was like 2022 just partisanship like vote for the person with the D next their name.

“But I think that that action, you know, we have seen because of Karen Bass that it has its limits.”

I don't want to like talk shit too much. I don't know who John voted for. I do think that the pod borrows you don't have to talk I'll talk shit for you. I do think that the pod borrows maybe I've been a change of tune on Karen Bass. No, but they want, they want if you're on and now. And it's funny. I'm put put them aside. There are lots of Democrats here who just like will be on Instagram saying Karen Bass is a disaster that, you know, she has failed the city. The very same people who four years earlier were saying that Karen Bass was going to save LA against an anti abortion

and many Trump billionaire named Rick Crusoe. It's like, you guys voted for this person, you know, and you're allowed to change your minds, I guess. But it's just like, it looks just kind of silly and hindsight. And speaking of smears, they were smearing her career. So, who would have been kind of a Daniel Lurie style. This is my main pick, pick with your Spencer Pratt thing. It's the Pratt wasn't really that much like Lurie, but Karuso was. I didn't say it was like Lurie style.

I had like an argument that I had formulated like years ago that was a nuanced take on what Obama should have done with regards to the Merrick Garland nomination. But I short-handed when the conversation with Tana-Hassie coats in a way that made it like actually wrong. I'd said to Tana-Hassie that Obama should have just jammed through Merrick Garland, which many people rightly were making fun of me for, because they're like, he couldn't do that, they're only 46 Democratic senators. The point that I meant to make that I didn't was that in that moment, Obama quit campaigning for that. It's go to see.

They were really like, and he had two options. He thought the norms would prevail. The reality is that he thought, this started because coats was bringing up that Obama didn't believe Trump could win.

And because he didn't believe Trump could win, it's kind of like the nominated Garland, and it's like whatever Hillary will clean this up next year. Really, they should have wanted two things. Like go, this will be less appealing to the coats crowd, but like go to the Republicans and say, who could I nominate that you would bring up, and like actually work with them on someone, and maybe they never would have done that. I don't know, but you could have put pressure on them. Like, or like use Barack Obama's skill set to actually go out and make this a major campaign issue that they're blocking this and that they want to take away your abortion rights, and et cetera, et cetera.

And like, they didn't really do either of those things. It wasn't a campaign issue in 2016. I think it was. Like, did he really campaign to get Merrick Garland through? I mean, like, really like to the dream that the Republicans campaign for Supreme Court justices. Like, was there anything comparative?

“I went to, I went to get all Wikipedia and try to remember the 114th Congress and there were 46, 44 Dems to independence, 46 Democrats. So if he swapped out Garland, like, which of these Republicans would have?”

You know, disobeyed Mitch McConnell and voted for the replacement. Like, Kelly A. Ots, like, Danes, like, Markowski. I don't know who to flip. Maybe, I guess, but I don't know. People are pretty beholden to Mitch McConnell at that point. It's a fair point. I mean, you are clearly wrong. I was clearly wrong. It's a fair point. I was clearly wrong. I remember at the time feeling like that it was a lame duck effort that there's a little bit of senioritis. And it was like, we're going to put Garland up, and I think coats is argument, which which which is maybe a better one.

It's like, if you're not going to be able to get it through, don't put out nearly mouth Merrick Garland. Like, put out somebody that people would be very excited about and make it a campaign issue, you know, so people realize. I will tell you in 26 and only just put it this way. I was totally wrong, but I do think this is an important learning. It's like, I remember in 2016 speaking, because this was really more of my world, to many anti-Trump Republican types, College Educator Public Attempts, one of our mutual friends Graham mother, somebody that I would mention on this.

And she was such to me, you know, I don't like him, but I got a vote for him over the courts. You know, I got we have to vote for him over the Supreme Court, because there's going to be an appointment up.

“And I just don't think that same thing was happening going the other way. Like, I don't think that there was a big effort to be like, you have to vote for Hillary, because you're going to take away your abortion.”

This has been a minor preoccupation, mine for a long time, actually, because for whatever reason covering Republican politics for so long, and, you know, that's how I know you from the pre-Trump era. Like, I just read a lot about the evangelical movement and, you know, their alliance with Republican politics and the Christian coalition and Jerry, following all of that. Republican coalition and the white evangelical vote have long made, appointing justices to the court, like, you know, stop row, going back to the 70s, like their thing.

And you see people on Twitter on the left over the years, being like, we've got a vote for Democrats because of the Supreme Court.

It just, it's never inspired the similar, similar passion with the Democratic base at all.

Like, so, if Tani Hisi is saying, and I listened to that pod, and it was really good, you know, they should have put up Katanji Brown Jackson, and that would have inspired people to go out.

“But like, no, not really, I don't think so. I think maybe not.”

The Democrats are just generally concerned with an issue set, and by the way, they should be concerned the RBG. And now, I think that's changing. I think it's much now.

Maybe, maybe, but I just think it's always been more judges has always been a thing you would hear in Republican primaries for House and Senate and like Ohio or Texas on the Republican side.

And just, it's as judges is something that didn't really come up outside of like nerdy or like Harvard Law grad Democrats running for office. Me, a couple, we all bad takes that one to his mind. I have two desserts. It's a multi-course dessert. We're way over time, so we'll do them quickly. First one, I just, I just want to give everybody an update on Brian, no, in Bimbabwe vacation. There's some sad news on this front.

The text that I've been a really bad boy. She responded, "Oh, I know. I know you've been a bad boy."

“And then after that, she felt bad and ultimately told him that she needed to distance herself and ghost him, that this relationship couldn't move on.”

So that's just a pretty sad development on the Brian, no Bimbabwe vacation news. He has pride on Tim and you're more flowing in queer communities than I am. Where would Brian wants to go full Bimbabwe? Where should he move to? The West Village? I don't know, you know, an early community in trans culture.

It was in Colorado actually, it's in Trinidad, south of Fueblo. So maybe he could start a new community there, kind of a Bimbabwe community in Trinidad, because it would kind of speak to their historical significance. And that's the first thing that comes to mind. Fort Lauderdale would be a second choice. Florida, yeah, yeah, Fort Lauderdale, maybe.

My last thing is a surprise I have for you. Today is the 17 year anniversary of what? We'll go to the audio tape. I had a conversation with Gina Smith this morning, I arrived in Atlanta. And I told her about my love of the application trails.

And I used to organize making trips, actually when I was in high school, I would get a soccer coach or football coach to act as a chaperone, and then I get folks to pay me 60 bucks each or whatever was to take the trip, and then off would go and have these great adventures in the application trail. Seven minutes later.

And so the bottom line is this. I've been on Facebook from that line.

But I'm faithful to my line. I developed a relationship with a, which started as a dear dear friend from Argentina. It began very, very innocently, as I suspect many of these things do. These things are just a casual email back and forth in advice on one's life there, and advice here. But here recently over this last year,

it developed into something much better than that. I was in the room. You were there. I was there. So I got a little tear-eyed like Mark Sanford watching that,

because that was my first big break. I broke the news that Sanford's car was parked at the airport,

and not somewhere else on the Appalachian Trail,

set off more alarm bells. I was standing right next to Mark to stage left. It was just like I was down there for CNN. It was the biggest story in the entire world. Japanese television came into Columbia, South Carolina,

German TV, like different era. All the networks were trying to book Jenny Sanford and Mark Sanford. And by the way, those emails that Mark mentioned,

“you know how the affair got discovered. Do you remember this?”

I don't know. So he was writing emails to Maria Balenchapur, who's not with anymore. He would mark an oddball, would print them off, and keep them in a file folder, and Jenny just found the emails printed off.

Not good digital hygiene there if you're trying to have an affair, but wow, man. It was a hot summer down there. I was working for CNN and breaking off kinds of news, they were going to impeach Mark Sanford.

The Republicans were doing this and that. Here's a story about the affair, Maria and the cops and whatever. All this fun little tribal politics stuff in South Carolina. And then my boss calls me, I'm in the Hilton in Columbia. You and me love the Hilton.

We've stayed there many times. Hey Peter, what are you doing? I'm like, oh, I got the scoop. The house is putting together articles of impeachment against Mark Sanford.

“And he's like, okay, cool, you should stop.”

And I was like, what are you talking about? He goes, Michael Jackson just died. You can come home now. And it was like, obviously the biggest story in the world was suddenly Michael Jackson and CNN was covering that.

And I was having as a young reporter like the time of my life in Columbia. Like, hit it, go into five points every night. Like I just mentioned. And then I had to go back to reality in DC. So thank you for playing that.

Thank you for playing that. You're welcome. Okay, June 24th, 2009. I was at the Gay Beach House in her hope with all my besties. We had a summer Beach House back then.

And I made them all take a break from, I don't know, doing flip cup and watching Britney Spears music videos,

And I just, I just, the whole thing.

“Like my distinct memory is like, when is he giving you to the point?”

And like for the purpose of the podcast, we could have played a full seven minutes.

He spends, it's the longest wind up in history.

He is such a, such a weird fella. That Mark Sandford. But it's good about me for you.

I forgot that to that long.

Yeah, thanks for something. I appreciate you.

“Peter Handby, everybody go check him out on his podcast,”

which is shorter than mine. You know, if you need a little bit of more of a get right to the point update on what's happening. The day it's got the powers to be. Check them out over at Puck.

“And I hand-be and enjoy the USA World Cup game tomorrow night with our friends.”

We'll be seeing you soon, right, man. All right, buddy. Thank you. Everybody else, we're back here tomorrow for another edition of the show. See you all then, please. The more podcast is brought to you, thanks to the work of lead producer Katie Cooper,

associate producer Ansley Skipper, and with video editing by Katie Lutz, and audio engineering in editing by Jason Brown.